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BRICS, E7 Economies, and IBSA

Discussion in 'World Economy' started by santosh, Mar 26, 2014.

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  1. santosh

    santosh Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    further to my last post#285,

    hmmm, simply because "unskilled jobs are less paid", and skilled jobs are mainly occupied by immigrants professionals :...

    and now the new generation of these unskilled people exercising in India at present..
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2015
  2. santosh

    santosh Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    @Averageamerican
    @Picdelamirand-oil

    A Major Difference Between Indian and American Culture


    also, there is a major difference between Indian and US's culture, that is, "Indians pay for their kids while American kids grow on the tax money/welfare of high tax paying migrants, as they fall in high income bracket." :tsk:

    and im scared for that certain state, the Indian Society will reach one day, when Indian women too will start getting kids without marriage, but no Welfare/free medical to feed these kids as India is a developing country :facepalm:
    .

    =>
     
  3. santosh

    santosh Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    sink or swim....... there is a certain sign of an organization/ person/ nation etc, when its fall is near. we then find that certain form of organization/ person/ countries adopt all the right and wrong techniques to get something done, before an expected fall. and as per my 7-8 years of experience of geo-politics, when they never hesitated to use all the wrong techniques to get something done by this or that way, like lies/bluffs/wrong information to common public etc. hence its very easy for me to say, this gentleman and his commonwealth followers are very right with their worries :coffee:
    .
     
  4. santosh

    santosh Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    .

    Indian Economy on PPP would come closed to $11.0trillion, if we include 'undocumented' part of GDP too

    we find on PPP, Indian economy closed to $8.0trillion by end 2015, more than total of UK+Canada+Australia+Pakistan+Bangladesh+NewZealand+other Commonwealth countries...

    on PPP basis, we find Indian economy closed to $8.0trillion by end 2015...

    The World Factbook

    but it still doesn't includes the 'undocumented' part of GDP, the share of GDP of developing countries, which doesn't come in light, remains undocumented. which estimated over 30% in case of developing countries like India, Philippines, Vietnam, Thailand, China, Sri Lanka etc.

    and its not just the "non-Taxed" or "black money", but, more than half of the people of India aren't even aware that they would pay tax on the salary they earn....

    The World Factbook

    hence, i would say, by end of 2015, Indian economy would come closed to $11.0trillion on PPP term, if we consider the undocumented part of Gross Domestic Product (GDP) also.

    nowdays UK and their allies are hopeful to maintain food supply for their coming generation through India only, have bet theri every credibility to get this "Elephant", whose economy size is bigger than the total Commonwealth Economies as whole. with dreams of source of money and power from this country,only, by using Bangladeshi souls to occupy bodies of Indian govt-military-political people, including businessmen too...
    (the technologies of NASA-US, which were developed by the Indian immigrant professionals there itself, with immigrant professionals of other developing countries and Japan etc..... and this is the final outcome of these US's technologies, which is being used for every form of crimes in the countries like India... a disaster on this world as whole by UK and their allies...)

    .
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2015
  5. santosh

    santosh Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    British Slave Mentality

    Interfering in a country like India, which is growing with a healthy pace, only state "Slave Mentality" of British and British Origins . that is, they will either make slave or will become slaves, but certainly they can't build their society by themselves.....


    using technologies of US's labs, which were developed by the immigrant professionals of developing countries like India, which are being used for every form of crimes in world at present. a certain fall of this British society as whole, which is ready to destroy whole world at present, a crisis on the world society as whole....

    Indian Tax Payers pay hefty subsidy for the people below poverty line, spend heavy money to build infrastructure of this country, not because others may destroy it. food subsidy, cooking oil/cooking gas is sold for the price below half of its international price from the pocket of Indian Tax Payers, over a Trillion dollar is spent to build infrastructure of this country for the current 5 years plan, which only has a rising trend. and its has no space for the beggars of British terrorists, who are using spies of Bangladesh to help UK's coming generation maintain food supply some how....

    Indian economy till the 18th century was bigger than the EU as whole, which helped past generation of UK fed on Indian money. and now these falling economy, UK, has again come to India to help their coming generation fed on the India's Tax Payers money

    the beggars remained beggars, whether in past or the current state of their generations, the UK...

    => https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_regions_by_past_GDP_(PPP)#World_1.E2.80.932003_.28Maddison.29


    => The Discovery of India, Bharat Ek Khoj | Indian Defence Forum
    .
    =>
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2015
  6. santosh

    santosh Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    India failed to copy Chinese Economic Reform in 1991

    Average GDP Growth Rate of Asian Industrialized Countries Since 1981


    My this post is just to keep a record of the comparative 'Average' Growth rate of India with "Newly Asian Industrialized" countries, along with the Matured Industrialized Asian countries like Korea, Japan, Singapore as below.

    this effort is just to keep an eye on the Average Growth Rate of India since 1981 to 2013, as compare to other 'Asian' Industrialized Countries :thumb:

    Select Country or Country Groups

    Newly industrialized country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



    => Growth Rate Comparison since 1980 to 2013, for the 34 years

    1st, China: 9.89% since 1980

    2nd, India: 6.1% since 1981

    3rd, Philippines: 3.5% since 1980

    4th, Thailand: 5.4% since 1980

    5th, Indonesia: 5.2% since 1980

    6th, Malaysia: 5.8% since 1980

    7th, Singapore: 6.4% since 1980

    8th, Korea: 6.0% since 1980

    9th, Taiwan: 5.5% since 1980

    10th, Japan: 2.1% since 1980

    Select Country or Country Groups

    Newly industrialized country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



    => here, we generally know 1991 Economic Reform as the year, till then Per Capita Income of India was higher than that of China. and this comparison clearly tells us, how population growth rate of around 2% since 1981, with 500mil extra people this way, has covered every success of India since 1947. while total number of Middle Class of India is itself more than total population at the time of freedom, 1947 :facepalm:

    => we have a comparison of India and China's Per Capita Income on PPP since 1990 as below, telling us the difference between Indian Open Market strategy with Chinese one since 1990...... India could have only around 5.4% growth rate for the 12 years in between 1991 to 2001, because of failing to even 'copy' the Chinese or ASEAN region Economic Reforms in 1991. even during 80s, the growth rate of India was at around 5.8%, before 1991 economic reform, which pulled India's growth rate down to 5.4% during the 12 years time since 1991 to 2002 :tsk:
    :facepalm:)

    first 8.0%+ groath rate was achieved by 2003-04, under Vajpayee government, and then he retired by June 2004. and it was mainly because of the investment initiatives, he adopted since 1997, and its effects we saw since 2003-04 onwards...
    even MBA degree expires in every 10 years time, clearly stating, 1991 economic reform failed to copy those like China or ASEAN region, and the blame goes to the concerned government departments as whole....

    India GDP - real growth rate - Economy

    (and yes, India then became an "investment driven growth" economy since the Vajpayee government, similar to CHina-ASEAN region, true. higher the investments in infrastructure, higher the growth rate achieved....)

    => BRITAIN GDP PER CAPITA PPP at 1991, $23,924.22
    United Kingdom GDP per capita PPP | 1990-2014 | Data | Chart | Calendar

    RUSSIA GDP PER CAPITA PPP at 1991, $15,625.62
    Russia GDP per capita PPP | 1990-2014 | Data | Chart | Calendar | Forecast

    INDIA GDP PER CAPITA PPP at 1991, $1,812.36 :ranger:
    India GDP per capita PPP | 1990-2014 | Data | Chart | Calendar | Forecast

    CHINA GDP PER CAPITA PPP AT 1991, $1,554.01
    China GDP per capita PPP | 1990-2014 | Data | Chart | Calendar | Forecast
     
  7. santosh

    santosh Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    => while Average Growth Rate of India since 1951 itself stands at around 5.81% to date.....
    .
    => with that, there was a 'plagiarism case' on Indian Economic Reform in 1991 too :tsk:
     
  8. santosh

    santosh Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    @Ancient Indian

    Comparison of 10 years of 1981-90 to 1991-2000, considering early 1991 "Economic Reform" of India

    considering even MBA degree expires in 10 years time

    sir, further to the above post, we have some fundamental analysis of India's "Economic Reform" in early 1991 as below:

    1st; we have Excel Sheet Calculation of 10 years of 'Average Economic Growth Rate of India, for 1981-90 and 1991-2000, considering early 1991 as the year of Economic Reform. and 1981-90 10years, just before 1991 Economic Reform.

    Average Growth Rate 1981-90 = 5.58%
    Average Growth Rate 1991-2000= 5.57%
    (considering, even a MBA degree expires in 10 years time, and 2001+ of India belongs to the steps taken by Mr Vajpayee government during 1998-2004 periods....)

    India GDP - real growth rate - Economy
    .

    2nd; while comparing with China, its 'Excel Sheet' calculation of the 10 years of 1991-2000 as below:

    Average Growth Rate of India for the 10years 1991-2000 = 5.57% (or 55.7% marks for Mr Manmohan Singh, "passed".)
    India GDP - real growth rate - Economy

    Average Growth Rate of China for the 10years of 1991-2000 = 10.4% (or, 100%+ marking for Chinese Economic Reform...)
    China GDP - real growth rate - Economy

    3rd; we just discussed, if India suffered with Asian Economic Crisis during the 1998+, then the same is true for China also???? and if India's Economic Reform occurred by early 1991, you have no discount of leaving the year 1991 or 1992, when the growth rate of India was lower....

    4th; Chinese Economic Reform occurred by early 80s, following ASIAN economic reforms too, which resulted in 8.0%+ average growth rate of Indonesia, Thailand, Malaysia, Singapore etc during the whole 80s, check. and there was always a joke stating, "Per Capita Income of India was higher than that of China till 1991, as they couldn't even 'copy' Chinese or ASEAN Economic Reform of early 80s.
    and we are discussing, why the 10years period of 1991 to 2000 Economic Reform of India had 'bit' lesser growth rate than the 1981-1990 10 years period, the 10 years of just 1991 Economic Reform? (5.57% average growth rate during 1991-2000, as compare to 5.58% average growth rate of 1981-1990 period? on this Excel Sheet Calculation)

    5th; even till the period of 1991-97, the Rao government with the Finance minister Mr M.M.Singh, the Excel Sheet calculation of India's growth rate is "5.24%", much lower than 1981-90 10years period of 5.58% average growth rate..

    India GDP - real growth rate - Economy
    .
    6th; we find, total foreign investment in India during 1998-2004 period of Vajpayee government was much higher than 1991-97 period of Rao government. which does state more aggressive FDI policy of Vajpayee government than the Rao government. and yes, India too took the path of "Investment Driven Growth Rate", similar to China.... higher the investment in infrastructure, higher growth rate. for example of the current 5 years of plan, having around $1.0trillion investment in infrastructure, means for around $200billion a year in the $2.0trillion Indian economy on nominal terms, hence we would get at least 4%+ growth rate due to Investment in infrastructure only....
    7th; and i repeat, the calculation of Indian Economic Reform 'includes' 1991, leaving no discount for manipulation of 10years growth rate comparison of 10 years of 1991-2000 to 1981-90, the 10 years of just before "early 1991 of Indian Economic Reform"... and yes, the strategic decision is taken by the concern departments as whole, so it was more the "Rao Government Economic Reform", in its true sense....
    .
    8th; The Share of Agriculture in GDP:- one more dominant factor in GDP calculation of Asian Economies, whats the share of agriculture which may hardly grow at around 2% on long run, mainly in case of Asian developing economies like India-ASEAN-China????? we find, GDP's overall growth rate is mainly determinant of Industrial and Service sector's contribution.

    and for India, the 1981-90 10years time had around 35% share of Agriculture in Economy, 'on average for 1o years of 1981-90'.
    while the 1991 to 2000 10years period had around 25% share of Agriculture in GDP, "on average" of 1991 to 2000.

    means, 1981-90 period does suffer this dis-advantage too??? showing bit better performance of 80s as compare to India's Economic Reform period of 90s....
    .
    9th; last but not least, first 8%+ growth rate of India was achieved by the year 2003-04,and then Mr Vajpayee retired by June 2004, after 12 years of Economic Reform of early 1991.
    India logs 8.2% GDP growth rate in 2003-04

    while, even before Vajpayee government which started since 1998, "the 7 years" of 1991 to 1997 of Rao led economic reform achieved hardly around 5.24 average growth rate, as per Excel Sheet calculation from the IMF's data's as below.

    India GDP - real growth rate - Economy

    .

    10th; and what the "economic reform" really means for? check the growth rate of China, including ASEAN region like Malaysia, Thailand, Indonesia, Philippines, Singapore, since their early 80s economic reform, as below. over 8.0%+ growth for these economies was a news almost every year during the 80s, while this happiness India achieved after 12 years of 1991 economic reform, by the financial year 2003-04

    India is best comparable to CHina+ASEAN region 'only'. and its very true that first India had a 'late' Open Market Strategy, and also we got no learning of early 80s economic revolution in China+ASEAN.... just have a look on the 80s growth rate of China and ASEAN region as below, who had these open market strategy mainly since the early 80s..... and compare to first India's 8.0%+ growth rate by 2003-04,after 12 years of 1991 economic reform....

    Malaysia: http://www.indexmundi.com/malaysia/gdp_real_growth_rate.html


    China: http://www.indexmundi.com/china/gdp_real_growth_rate.html


    Thailand: http://www.indexmundi.com/thailand/gdp_real_growth_rate.html


    Indonesia: http://www.indexmundi.com/indonesia/gdp_real_growth_rate.html


    Singapore: http://www.indexmundi.com/singapore/gdp_real_growth_rate.html

     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2015
  9. santosh

    santosh Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    =>
    Income-Debt-Buying Power comparison of Indians, British and Americans
    (in exchange rates terms)

    Per Capita income of US = $50,000 (around)
    Per Capita Income of UK = $38,000 (around)
    Per Capita Income of India = $2,000 (around)

    25 times difference
    .

    => Government Debt
    Government Debt per Capita in US = $18.5trillion for 310 million population = $60,000

    Government Debt per Capita in India = $1.2trillion for 1.25billion population = $1,000

    Government Debt per Capita in UK = $2.2trillion for 64million population = $34,000


    => "Total Debt" Per Capita of US = $60.5trillion for 310million population = $190,00 per person (around)

    "Total Debt" Per Capita of India = $2.8trillion for 1.25billion population = $2,500 per person (around)

    Total Debt Per Capita on UK = $12.0trillion for 64 million population = $190,000 per person (around)

    around 80 times higher


    => buying products in Market, would be around 8 to 10 times difference, as per my experience.

    coffee in India at 30 cents and in Sydney its $3.2 (10 times difference)

    something we usual buy, a mineral water for Rs15 (30cents) in Delhi, while it was around $2.4, the cheapest one, for a similar one liter mineral water in Sydney.....

    the cheapest Chinese take away food at $12 plus $2.0 for water, as compare to i pay around Rs90 ($1.5) a time here in Delhi

    renting flat in Sydney starts with around $350 per week, the cheapest, means around $1,500 per month, plus other charges. as compare to renting a flat in my city, Lucknow, at around Rs 20,000 a month ($300).

    parking in city, as you first drive to a shopping complex and then buy food whose prices isn't much different than India, for example. and similarly, even if you watch a movie, you pay dollar as compare to rupees in India.

    even mobile charge at around 30 paisa per minute in India, less than 0.5 cent, while its around 20 cents per minute in Australia....

    even for transportation, its around Rs 20 rupees(30 cents) in Delhi metro, as compare to minimum $3.5 one way in Perth-Sydney metro.....

    i would put "on ground" purchasing power difference at around 8 to 10 times between India and US. the prices which matters us, the prices of driving, renting, food, travelling, mobile etc.... :tup:

    hence, $2,000 'exchange rate term' per capita income of India would stand at around $15,000, using the factor of '7.5', as per its prices in US, for the what we buy-use the money on the ground, which affect the buying power of people.
    hence this way, we find per capita income of India at around $15,000, as compare to per capita income of around $50,000 and $38,000 in case of US and UK respectively....
    .
    => while for the developing counties like India have their 40%+ GDP remains "undocumented", simply because they dont show their half of the salary. so even if we consider the factor just at around 5.0, GDP Per Capita of India would still come at around $15,000 on PPP, as compare to around $38,000 in UK and $50,000 in US. while high growth rate of India does promise a brighter future, while the today's OECD economies are mostly saturated, having done hefty cuts in budget expenditure since 2009 recession too, hence limited investment has further undermined the growth prospects. which would hard for them to even match with their 1.5% average growth rate of last 25years since 1991 too...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)#Lists
    .
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2015
  10. santosh

    santosh Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    .
    further, as discussed in the above post, the term "Total Debt" or "Overall Debt" includes Government Debt+Household Debt+Business debt, mainly....

    its a rough calculation for US-UK-India from the picture of 'The Economist' newspaper as below. an article about US's total debt, here we have.....
    .
    => the 'factored' Total Debt on major OECD economies is as below:-
     
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