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Chinese troops transgress Sikkim-Bhutan-Tibet tri-junction sector in Doka La / Dokalam Area

Discussion in 'International Relations' started by Agent_47, Jun 26, 2017.

  1. X_Killer

    X_Killer Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Doka La ground report Part I: Amid New Delhi-Beijing mind games, ‘patient’ Indian Army braces for long haul

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    Around fifty days into the India-China border row over Sikkim, the situation at the tri-junction remains tense. Even as Beijing and New Delhi play mind games, a different kind of contest is unfolding in freezing Doka La, where 250 Indian Army soldiers are facing down 250 troops from China’s People’s Liberation Army (PLA) . On 2 August, China issued a “fact sheet”, claiming India had reduced its troop numbers in Doka La from 400 to 40. India, for once, responded. External affairs minister Sushma Swaraj denied any troop reduction and the foreign ministry backed her up.

    Firstpost has learnt that 250 soldiers of the battle-hardened Jat regiment have been stationed at Doka La in two layers.

    A third layer comprising the Bofors guns — artillery that cut its teeth during the 1999 Kargil War – is primed to strike and pummel the enemy. India and China have a pact: At the Line of Actual Control (LAC), there must be an equal number of soldiers. Hence, the exact number of troops deployed by either side. A Chinese defence ministry spokesman boasted on 24 July: “It’s easier to shake a mountain than the PLA.” Perhaps the Chinese should have noted what British journalist Edmund Candler wrote of the Jats in his book The Sepoy: “It takes earthquakes and volcanoes to turn a regiment of these hard-bitten men out of a position they have been given to hold.”

    The “position given” to the Jats to “hold” now is Doka La. From all indications, it will be very difficult for the PLA to shake the taller Jats from their perch. More so because the terrain favours the Indian Army, which is proficient in mountain warfare. Fully prepared The first layer of the Indian Army has six-foot-tall Jats, all of them, with cameras. Which will only make the shorter PLA troops crane their necks upwards even more. Their marching orders are to keep a sharp eye on the enemy and capture their movements. Some of them are familiar with Mandarin.

    They will also keep their ears open. If the PLA attempts to make a move, the first wave of Indian soldiers will bear the brunt of the attack but hopefully not before they warn their heavily armed brethren. The soldiers in the second layer have been warned not to lower their guard and come out all guns blazing at any signs of aggression from the enemy camp. Patience is the buzzword at Doka La. The image that springs to mind is the hidden hand of the Dragon and the alertness of the crouching tiger. In their tents, the armies grab a quick bite, a sip of water or even a nap. Sleep is always welcome. Anything to distract from the jangling nerves.

    The bulk of the Indian Army is only 10 kilometres away from the tri-junction. A Punjabi soldier tells Firstpost: “At Doka La, we’re nose-to-nose with the enemy. Barely 250 metres separates us.” The soldier adds that a Black Cat platoon was the first to reach the spot after the border row kicked off. Then the Jat regiment was called in from the base camp at Nathu La. Another journalist backs up this claim, saying he walked right up to the Indian position at Doka La. “New bunkers are being built. The ground is being mined to preempt the Chinese attack. Machine-gun nests are being placed at strategic points, and soldiers are performing battle drills at least twice a day. But restraint is still the buzzword,” the journalist wrote, speaking about the Indian Army’s preparations. Which could be the reason Firstpost was not allowed entry — beyond a point — at Nathu La.

    Apparently, the media has been kept out of Doka La because of China propensity to use its state media to distort reports from other outlets. Stopped several kilometres from ground zero, Firstpost spoke to soldiers at Nathu La. They told us that that the Jat regiment has been told to keep calm and beware of PLA’s “creep” strategy. New Delhi sees Beijing’s rhetoric as part of the psychological warfare that it wages against all countries. However, it considers the rhetoric blunted by India’s response. A soldier stationed at Nathu La says that “the PLA were making preparations” much before they tried to extend a Class 4 road into Doka La. He also says while Indian Army bunkers are makeshift, those of the PLA are sturdier. “But we are ready to counter-attack. Our supply line is uninterrupted and our three-tier defence is unassailable,” he says. An army officer tells Firstpost that come September, Doka La will be snowed under. “Bunkers have been cleaned. Extreme cold weather is expected from September to October,” he says.

    “Each bunker can accommodate seven soldiers.” There are an estimated 1,200 bunkers in Nathu La. Meanwhile, China has been ramping up the rhetoric. On 4 August, it stated that it had run out of patience and demanded the immediate withdrawal of Indian troops from Doka La. The peace and tranquility of which Sushma Swaraj spoke in the Rajya Sabha on 3 August appears to have withered away. Nathu La is 14,000 feet above ground. At the tri-junction, the dagger-shaped Chumbi Valley points straight at our slender Chicken’s Neck (Siliguri Corridor). India sees the PLA’s efforts to build a road into Doka La, which Bhutan considers “disputed territory”, as a direct threat to her national security. India’s security apparatus is worried that China’s game plan is to cut off India’s contact with her North East. “We were ordered to stop the Chinese penetration into Doka La,” a soldier tells Firstpost, speaking on the condition of anonymity. “But before we actually stopped them, they demolished some of our bunkers at Lalten Chowky.”

    He says the army base camp is just 15 kilometres away from the ugly standoff. The mind of the soldier “Not only is the border tense but things are tense at home too. Do we handle the border or our families?” a soldier asks, displaying a string of WhatsApp messages. To keep spirits up, senior officers give their “boys” deployed at the tri-junction daily pep talks. They are gently reminded that, whatever the cost, they are to keep an even keel. “Whenever a soldier returns from duty, senior officers make it a point to approach him,” an army officer says. “We talk to them and ease their worries. If we spot signs of anger, depression or irritation, we take him off duty. The psychological warfare from both sides can take a toll on even the best of soldiers. In such a tense situation, it becomes crucial that no soldier slips up.” The officer adds that within 48 hours of the 18 June standoff, an entire company based at Gangtok was deployed at Doka La. The company comprised 3,000 soldiers. The Chinese reciprocated India’s gesture.

    Indian soldiers have constructed helipads on Sikkim’s hilly terrain. The “long grass” has been “flattened” with the help of villagers from Kupuk and Julup. Soldiers usually make friends with the locals over a cup of tea. Mangal Jeet Rai, a resident of Kupuk village tells Firstpost: “My son is in the army. So I know the difficulties the men in uniform face while serving the nation. They keep us safe.” Rai says three youth from Julup show their appreciation for the soldiers by providing them with chickens. Village elders say that if war comes, they will stand shoulder-to-shoulder with the army. KB Rai, an ex-servicemen, says that when winter comes, villagers will move to the Gangtok base camp. However, the Jat soldiers will remain. Braving the cold. Guarding the frontier, right up to the tri-junction. Their eyes peeled for what lies beyond.

    http://www.firstpost.com/india/doka...indian-army-braces-for-long-haul-3906079.html
     
  2. sangos

    sangos Lt. Colonel SENIOR MEMBER

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    Lets see what can be done. Detailed maps give good sense of Orbat. I thought 'satellite' maps look confusing - what I meant.
     
  3. Kalmuahlaunda

    Kalmuahlaunda Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Basically what China did to USA on SCS, India did to China on Dokhlam
     
  4. Hellfire

    Hellfire Devil's Advocate Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Best kept at the Google Maps. If someone bother's to follow the tracks/trails, will be able to pinpoint the positions Indian Army holds adequately to get a sense of the level of force that can be brought to bear upon in the area.
     
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  5. Hellfire

    Hellfire Devil's Advocate Staff Member MODERATOR

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    No.

    It is different. Doka-La has Indian Army defences already. I can not divulge post names, but you can just use google map and magnify to get an idea of Indian Army positions and gun positions there.
     
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  6. Angel Eyes

    Angel Eyes FULL MEMBER

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    Sirr, how can we counter Chinese 300 mm rocket artillery in case of a conflict...??
     
  7. Hellfire

    Hellfire Devil's Advocate Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Sirr, please quit the sirr :)

    We have our own toys for them. WLR will do the work.

    And both sides follow the Soviet Doctrine of massed Artillery Shelling, with one unit obliterating a 1 square kilometer area in a very short span of time. So ... brace, make good defences and hope for best that you locate and lay down an effective counter-battery fire.

    It holds true for either side.
     
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  8. X_Killer

    X_Killer Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    sorry to say but its a duplicate post
    http://indiandefence.com/threads/ch...oka-la-dokalam-area.62108/page-54#post-584566
     
  9. lca-fan

    lca-fan Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    What if we enter Kalapani, Kashmir: China to India
    PTI|
    Updated: Aug 08, 2017, 08.24 PM IST
    [img vspace="0" marginheight="0" marginwidth="0" border="0" width="210" src="http://img.etimg.com/thumb/msid-599...-we-enter-kalapani-kashmir-china-to-india.jpg" ..=""
    Read more at:
    http://economictimes.indiatimes.com...ofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst

    And we we'll let this ugly LIZARD enter, the lizard has gone mad after IA pulled their pants off doing them FULL MONTY in front of all world powers making them laughing stock :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
     
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  10. lca-fan

    lca-fan Major SENIOR MEMBER

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  11. vstol jockey

    vstol jockey Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    on 18th, Rahu-Ketu are changing signs and the new axis will lie in Cancer-Capricorn signs. This means whatever China may try, India will win the war and war is inevitable after 18th August. If its not China, it might be Pakistan or both.
     
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  12. InfoWarrior

    InfoWarrior 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    India should develope cyber hacker army. In this field India has advantage over China. If China does small army operation, we get reason to unleash our IT prowess on China. Lots of IT workers are jobless in India.

    China mounts cyber attacks on Indian sites
    Indrani Bagchi | TNN | May 5, 2008, 01:16 AM IST
    NEW DELHI: China���s cyber warfare army is marching on, and India is suffering silently. Over the past one and a half years, officials said, China has mounted almost daily attacks on Indian computer networks, both government and private, showing its intent and capability. (Watch: ���China's cyber intrusion a threat���)

    The sustained assault almost coincides with the history of the present political disquiet between the two countries.

    According to senior government officials, these attacks are not isolated incidents of something so generic or basic as "hacking" ��� they are far more sophisticated and complete ��� and there is a method behind the madness.

    Publicly, senior government officials, when questioned, take refuge under the argument that "hacking" is a routine activity and happens from many areas around the world. But privately, they acknowledge that the cyber warfare threat from China is more real than from other countries.

    The core of the assault is that the Chinese are constantly scanning and mapping India���s official networks. This gives them a very good idea of not only the content but also of how to disable the networks or distract them during a conflict.

    This, officials say, is China���s way of gaining "an asymmetrical advantage" over a potential adversary.

    The big attacks that were sourced to China over the last few months included an attack on NIC (National Infomatics Centre), which was aimed at the National Security Council, and on the MEA.

    Other government networks, said sources, are routinely targeted though they haven���t been disabled. A quiet effort is under way to set up defence mechanisms, but cyber warfare is yet to become a big component of India���s security doctrine. Dedicated teams of officials ��� all underpaid, of course ��� are involved in a daily deflection of attacks. But the real gap is that a retaliatory offensive system is yet to be created.

    And it���s not difficult, said sources. Chinese networks are very porous ��� and India is an acknowledged IT giant!

    There are three main weapons in use against Indian networks ��� BOTS, key loggers and mapping of networks. According to sources in the government, Chinese hackers are acknowledged experts in setting up BOTS. A BOT is a parasite program embedded in a network, which hijacks the network and makes other computers act according to its wishes, which, in turn, are controlled by "external" forces.

    The controlled computers are known as "zombies" in the colourful language of cyber security, and are a key aspect in cyber warfare. According to official sources, there are close to 50,000 BOTS in India at present ��� and these are "operational" figures.

    What is the danger? Simply put, the danger is that at the appointed time, these "external" controllers of BOTNETS will command the networks, through the zombies, to move them at will.

    Exactly a year ago, Indian computer security experts got a glimpse of what could happen when a targeted attack against Estonia shut that country down ��� it was done by one million computers from different parts of the world ��� and many of them were from India! That, officials said, was executed by cyber terrorists from Russia, who are deemed to be more deadlier.


    The point that officials are making is that there are internal networks in India that are controlled from outside ��� a sort of cyberspace fifth column. Hence, the need for a more aggressive strategy.

    Key loggers is software that scans computers and their processes and data the moment you hit a key on the keyboard.
    Top Comment
    what is wrong with China--Mentally retarded nation
    This information is immediately carried over to an external controller ��� so they know even when you change your password. Mapping or scanning networks is done as a prerequisite to modern cyber warfare tactics. MEA has a three-layered system of computer and network usage ��� only the most open communication is sent on something called "e-grams".

    The more classified stuff uses old-economy methods ��� ironically, probably the most secure though a lot more time-consuming. The same is true of other critical areas of the government. But the real gap inside the national security establishment is one of understanding the true nature of the threat.

    National security adviser M K Narayanan set up the National Technology Research Organization, which is also involved in assessing cyber security threats. But the cyber security forum of the National Security Council has become defunct after the US spy incident. This has scarred the Indian establishment so badly that it���s now frozen in its indecision. This has seriously hampered India���s decision-making process in cyber warfare.
    http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...ian-sites/articleshow/3010288.cms?referral=PM
     
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  13. Golden_Rule

    Golden_Rule Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Moreover the directions represented by Jupiter-Mercury-Rahu-Venus are NE-N-SW-SE and so we can look at activity with China border - Pakistan border - Arabian Sea and the Bay of Bengal.
     
  14. Vyom

    Vyom Captain GEO STRATEGIC ANALYST

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    I am not a total skeptic on Jyotish shashtra, but I am an illiterate in its language. Can you Paraphrase it to normal conversation levels ?
     
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  15. X_Killer

    X_Killer Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Unable to understand this.
    Please summarise it ...
     

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