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Dassault Aviation seeks clarity on role of HAL in supply of Rafale

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by Sinchan, Dec 9, 2012.

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  1. Sinchan

    Sinchan Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    NEW DELHI: After bagging the multi-billion dollar deal for supplying 126 Rafale fighter aircraft to the IAF, French firm Dassault Aviation has asked the defence ministry to define the role of Hindustan Aeronautics Limited in the project.
    If the contract is finalised, the first 18aircraft would be supplied by Dassault directly to the Indian Air Force and the remaining 108 would be licence-produced at HAL facilities in Bangalore.
    The French Dassault has asked the ministry to define the role of the premier Indian aerospace company in the final delivery of the 108 aircraft to be produced in India, industry sources told here.
    As per the IAF tender issue for the project, the primary role for integration and supply of these aircraft would be of the HAL, which is successfully working on several important fighter aircraft projects such as the Su-30MKI project.
    The French company has told the ministry that if it is given the overall responsibility for the project, it should be given the freedom to decide on the proportion of work to be done by the HAL and private companies in the programme, they said.
    In that case, the firm would determine the role of the defence and security wing of a new Indian defence company in the project and a major share of work would be given to it, they said.
    Soon after Dassault was declared as the lowest bidder for the MMRCA (Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft) deal pipping EAD's Eurofighter, it signed an MoU with a Reliance Industries Limited company for working together in the security sector. It is currently negotiating thedeal with the defence ministry and the IAF.
    For completing the Indian project, Dassault has also opened an Indian subsidiary company here. The company named Dassault Aircraft Services India Private Limited (DASIPL) was set up recently and it is100 per cent owned by its French parent company, they said.
     
  2. Gessler

    Gessler BANNED BANNED

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    The role of HAL is clear : delaying the production by any possible means
     
  3. brahmos_ii

    brahmos_ii Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    Have some faith bro as we have only one org that can do and also controlled by uneducated politician...
     
  4. Devil

    Devil Captain SENIOR MEMBER

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    Hal needs to be expanded more however it should be overseen by somebody else as i have no trust in govt it need strict CEO
     
  5. Anees

    Anees Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-pock

    Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-pocket

    The government's negotiations with Dassault on the $20-billion deal to buy 126 medium multi-role combat aircraft have come to a standstill after the French aviation firm informed authorities that it cannot be held responsible for the 108 aircraft to be produced by HAL (Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd).

    What started as a point of difference between the defence ministry and Dassault over the role of HAL escalated after the firm told Indian negotiators that the government will have to sign separate contracts — one with Dassault for 18 'fly-away' aircraft and another with HAL, which will produce 108 jets under licence.

    Dassault said it will supply manufacturing kits and equipment to HAL on time after which the contract with HAL will take over and Dassault will play no further role.

    MoD is learnt to have completely rejected this suggestion and made it clear to Dassault that it will be solely responsible for the sale and delivery of all 126 aircraft. The deal will be only with Dassault and it will be the single point of contact, sources said.

    The problem has its roots in the request for proposal document, which mandated that the winning firm will supply 18 aircraft and licence manufacture 108 in India. Also, it specified HAL as the prime integrator for this purpose.

    After winning the bid, Dassault sought clarity on HAL's role and said it should have the freedom to decide the degree to which it intends to involve HAL. However, MoD clarified in January that HAL was mandated as the prime integrator and would remain so.

    This seems to be the cause of the trouble, sources said, as none of the bidders held any discussions with HAL before submitting bids. Therefore, HAL-related issues were possibly not factored into the bids and to now work out the terms and conditions with HAL could prove tough.

    It is learnt that Dassault has been at it for a while, but time is beginning to run out with sources indicating that MoD does not want this to linger beyond this month.

    Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-pocket - Indian Express




    Why this F**K happening NOW.....:frust::hitwall::facepalm::YUNO: ???????
     
  6. Nagaraj

    Nagaraj 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Re: Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-

    WTF, IAF's squadron strength is decreasing and now this shit is happening. it looks like we won't get the MRCA before 2020.:frust:
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2013
  7. brahmos_ii

    brahmos_ii Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    Last edited: Apr 5, 2013
  8. WMD

    WMD Captain SENIOR MEMBER

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    Re: Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-

    its the usual BS published by Indian news media which doesn't know the diff. between a tank and a howitzer.
    no need to panic, the deal will get signed and mostly as per the demands of GoI.
    the experience gained through rafale will act as building block for AMCA.
     
    2 people like this.
  9. Devil

    Devil Captain SENIOR MEMBER

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    Re: Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-

    I am not confident of HAL's Abilities after Russia said indian migs are more likely to fall than russian built. It might be good experience for HAL however remember its fighter jet not a toy that we cannot play with lives of our pilots, eventhough i want HAL's to gain experience and more knowledge and have more jobs. It is not really good choice to build them in india on other hand france is doing this more likely to get production going and get some people jobs in those firms. so this is a tricky situation how congress or coming PM Modi handles it will be something to be seen
     
  10. smestarz

    smestarz Lt. Colonel REGISTERED

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    Re: Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-

    This is an interesting scenario and there is chance that EFT might be able to get a foothold... but assuming this situation is reported correctly. HAL might gain more from Sukhoi than Dassault or EFT.
    Further if HAL does hold its position (which it has right to) and both Dassault and EFT show no interest then in order to get the numbers, there is chance that India might go for follow on numbers of Su-30 MKI sooner upgraded to Super Sukhoi standards. Since we are already using this plane, it would be just a follow on order.
    Does anyone else see a different situation?
     
  11. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    Re: Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-

    Yes Dassault will give penalities to HAL in case of failure, and HAL will asks Indian government to pay such penalities in case they are activated.

    So the risk return to government because it's government which impose HAL as prime.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2013
  12. smestarz

    smestarz Lt. Colonel REGISTERED

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    Re: Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-

    From the article I understood that
    a) Dassault that it will be solely responsible for the sale and delivery of all 126 aircraft
    b) HAL was mandated as the prime integrator and would remain so.
    c) Thus it it is left to Dassault to deal with HAL and Dassault has to ensure that HAL builds the planes as per the specifications and Dassault will be responsible for the quality and also to make sure that HAL absorbs the technology.

    Thus this becomes case of a child (HAL) who has problem with studying and the father (GoI) has appointed the school teacher (dasault) for educating him. and Dassault has to be sure that the child understands the subject well but at the same time the teacher should not force the kid to study, the kid can study if he wants to when he wants to and how he wants to,

    Interesting scenario if its so, as then GoI would be trying to get Dassault to teach and ensure that HAL learns., but GoI do not want to do any such efforts,

    Peculiar case
     
  13. GUNS-N- ROSES

    GUNS-N- ROSES Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    Re: Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-

    i guess every one has missed the gist of the matter.

    this is a simple case of contractor "making a fool" of us. there is a need to have all parties involved in one contract. Dassault is cleverly trying to get away from liabilities.

    this has been observed several contracts executed by IAF. i cannot name them for security reasons.

    it is time govt acts tough and there should be one single tri-party agreement. other wise IAF will blame HAL for a problem and HAL will turn blame dassault.
     
  14. GUNS-N- ROSES

    GUNS-N- ROSES Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    Re: Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-

    no chance for EFT buddy. definitely not at this stage.
     
  15. smestarz

    smestarz Lt. Colonel REGISTERED

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    Re: Dassault wants HAL role separated, $20-billion combat aircraft jet deal hits air-

    This might get an interesting thread , be sure
     
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