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F-35 inferior to T-50 & J-20 in head to head combat - Carlo Kopp

Discussion in 'The Americas' started by Optimist, Sep 22, 2011.

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  1. G777

    G777 Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Agreed, any plane can fire missiles.
     
  2. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    The old guy does not know what he is talking about. US planes have been involved in combat more then any other planes in the world, and the air force has evolved beyond what the rest of the world is capable of achieving. Same way with US ground forces. I thought about adding India Airforce to the Darwin awards after the IAF crashing 500 flying coffins and buying more. Either the Russians are doing a hell of a sales job to India or some one from the Indian goverment is getting a hell of a kick back.

    Think about it you can have all the education, equipment,, training in the world but nothing ever comes close to beating experience.
     
  3. G777

    G777 Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    That is true that the US has had more experience in wars but please realise that the old guy does say many things that are true. You need good pilots and that requires flying hours, as I said in my list to UKIP, the F35 hasnt even been built in significant numbers for the amount of years they have had (even for the US), Even France has more Rafales than F35s. And because France has put its fighter into service early they will have better pilots than any F35 pilot. And better pilots in a really good aircraft could defeat enemy aircraft in numbers!!!!

    [​IMG]

    Eurofighter guys got excited when they went up against a bunch of F15s with a few Typhoons and destroyed them, yes the exercise was simulated (so it might or might not happen in reality) but it shows that a good plane with a good pilot can take on multiple enemys, good planes like:

    Gripen (over 163 Gripens in service as of January 2011, more to come):

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Rafale (100+, more to come):

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Eurofighter (300 as of October 2011, more to come):

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    And becase all newer aircraft have supercruise which many US aircraft do not have that makes them vulnerable in a BVR battle. Which means an experienced pilot could be killed before the dogfight happens and if the US are still planning to replace their old aircraft with (LESS or so I hear from other US sources) F35s. Now what experience are your pilots going to get with that? Even the US are getting more worried about advancing tech outside the US, there were reports of when the J20 took flight and the US sent two aircraft carriers closer to China.

    Two best jets that could cut it to be in a modern air war is the F22 and the F15 (once turned into a Silent Eagle).

    F35 close in support???

    A comment from USAAIRPOWER:

    "Pierre Sprey should fix the F-22 problems of standing against .50 caliber and oxygen problem. He should redesign some of the F-22 raptor parts to make it newer and better than ever. He should come up a new composite armor to make F-22 stand against .50 caliber and also find way to make F-22 not heavy so it can carry many weapons. A good pilot can't fly a s##k #ss d#ck fighter jets only in the best design aircraft. Pierre Sprey should be in charge not those punks who suck at it."

    I like this idea ^, I had to censor some bits.

    You see Pieere Sprey did design the A-10 and you have these pricks at Lockheed Martin that say the F35 can do close in support? How? It has no armour, its an expensive stealth plane and it has this fancy tech that (beyond all reason) has to fly close to an enemy to shoot them, which it then risks getting shot:

    [​IMG]

    And weapons are getting better and better.

    And what is written in the past cannot be changed but there is still time to change the outcome of the future. Always is.
     
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  4. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Compareing an A10 to an F35 is kind of like compareing an bow and arrow to a 50 caliber sniper rifle. Just short of compareing apples to oranges. There rumors that the F35 has a weapon that can take down another plane 75 miles away with out missiles or bullets. One of the reasons we are not useing it over hostile territory. Pierre Sprey is still fighting the last war.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2012
  5. Vritra

    Vritra Major ELITE MEMBER

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    Yes, rumours being the key word here.

    And you've completely missed the point of the A10 argument; the F-35 is not an aircraft that can perform the CAS duty as well as the A-10. It cannot take a beating and still land, it cannot loiter, it cannot fly efficiently at such low altitudes for long. So regardless of the veracity of the claim that the F-35 can take down another "plane" 75 miles away without missiles or bullets, the F-35 is no A10 replacement.


    You mean apart from it not being combat ready yet?
     
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  6. G777

    G777 Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Exactly my point. Thankyou.

    Though I am not sure what he means about the whole no bullets nor missiles to take down a plane. Then whats the point in having missiles or guns in the first place? I suppose getting the Meteor to fit in its bay or possibly getting Iris-T is a complete waste of time. Unless somone thinks that it harness the power of the ABL which doesnt even work well yet.
     
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  7. Vritra

    Vritra Major ELITE MEMBER

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    Dunno. Maybe these "rumours" refer to DEWs. High energy lasers and the sort. Even if said rumours were true, which I highly doubt, there's no way the US would be willing to export it. Hence the need to figure out how to get an Iris-T or an ASRAAM into the damn thing's internal bays: to appease the export customers.
     
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  8. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Just forget I said that.
     
  9. Picard

    Picard Lt. Colonel RESEARCHER

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    And how is it going to escape?
     
  10. DragonKnight

    DragonKnight Lieutenant SENIOR MEMBER

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    F-35 is a highly sophisticated and advanced machine..........that is what is killing the JSF program.
     
  11. Picard

    Picard Lt. Colonel RESEARCHER

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    And US generals were always fighting next war and as result US pilots died unnecessarily whenever things didn't align perfectly for US (incompetent enemy, AWACS avaliability, heavy numerical, technological, tactical and training superiority by US forces).

    F35 can't perform CAS. Too fast, too vulnerable, too reliant on jammable gadgets... one EMP bomb, and guess what happens.

    And the fact that you should never bring a sniper into CQC.
     
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  12. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    One thing for sure very few US pliots died compared to the enemy and if a F35 or F22 ever engages in head to head combat its a extreme mission failure of catastrophic proportions.
     
  13. smestarz

    smestarz Lt. Colonel REGISTERED

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    I read somewhere recently that they stopped the development of ABL, or did I misread?
     
  14. smestarz

    smestarz Lt. Colonel REGISTERED

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    F-35 is a nice design but I think they are expecting too many things from one plane at the same time
    It is not evolution like the Teens, where F-15 started as Air superiority fighter and now has capability to strike also. same for F/A-18.

    Just a nice non related line for F-35
    It's cool, its hot.
    It's trying to be everything it's not,
     
  15. Guynextdoor

    Guynextdoor Lt. Colonel SENIOR MEMBER

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    That was the whole push...one plane many roles. Over a period of time the commonality of the platform will bring down costs and increase efficiency (no matter which army or AF, budgets and savings are a priority). But as with most american projects- the most efficient project usually ends up costing much much more than the inefficient ones...
     
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