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F22 Analysis, News and Updates

Discussion in 'The Americas' started by Picard, Feb 25, 2012.

  1. BMD

    BMD Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Well look at the facts.

    1) There is no evidence that Rafale has managed to kill a Raptor but the Typhoon definitely has.

    2) There is no physical evidence to prove the Rafale claims against the Typhoon.

    3) Typhoon has lower wing loading, higher thrust-to-weight and larger instability margin.

    4) The French bullshit a lot.
     
  2. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    The F-22 kill was claimed by a Rafale pilot.
     
  3. BMD

    BMD Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Yet no markings.
     
  4. BON PLAN

    BON PLAN Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    During all the film, Rafale whas behind F22. Some times not in the HUD field of view.
     
  5. BON PLAN

    BON PLAN Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    1 and 2 ) During a Corsica training, with GB conditions of fight (altitude, situation of the merge....), Rafale win 7 to 1. The 1 lost was due to a flight under the low altitude floor.

    Since some years, GB refuse to train against Rafale.....

    3) instability margin? Rafale has a slightly better instantaneous turn rate. And just see the two planes ! on EF it seems as engineers forgot air intakes and add it at the last moment ! see the connexion between body and wings. Rafale has a better aerodynamic, so it needs less thrust (and it weights at least one ton less)

    4) without strong argument the end is always like that. :help:
     
  6. BON PLAN

    BON PLAN Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    Show me a EF or a F22 with a Rafale marking please.

    just one " :rafale: "
     
  7. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    [​IMG]

    Actual video begins at 2:15. Rafale’s speed at beginning is 360 knots, and it is turning at cca 6 g.

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    It continues turning, with a bit of rolling, at 4-6 g, entire time keeping the speed above 300 knots and even getting it up to 500 before executing a semi-vertical turn and achieving over 8 g at 2:46.

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    At 2:49, F-22 flies into the view from right, and Rafale rolls, pulling up and gaining altitude afterwards, loosing F-22 at 2:54.

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    Afterwards, Rafale turns around, pointing nose towards the F-22 flying below it at 3:04 and achieving a lock-on and a missile launch at 3:07.
     
  8. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    [​IMG]


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    Rafale’s speed at time of missile launch was 157 kts. At 3:10, gun targeting outline appears. At 3:23, F-22 is again in view, though it does not result in either gun or missile kill, and Rafale pilot does not roll to follow the F-22.


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    Rafale continues turning until nose is pointed upwards at 3:35, after which it turns towards the ground. At 3:59, it again has nose pointed mostly upwards, and turns sideways towards the ground.
     
  9. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    [​IMG]


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    At 4:10, F-22 is again in sight, and Rafale turns inside the F-22. At 4:20 lock-on is achieved but Rafale pilot does not call a missile kill, with low speed warning appearing at 4:26 (speed cca 120 kts) and disappearing at 4:28, to reappear at 4:29; low fuel warning appears at 4:26.
     
  10. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    [​IMG]

    At 4:29, Rafale rolls, with speed at 4:31 being 91 knots, staying below 100 knots for next few seconds, causing low speed warning to blip.

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  11. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    [​IMG]


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    At 4:35, Rafale is turing towards the ground and speed has gone above 100 knots again. Rafale gets F-22, which has regained the energy, in its view at 4:40; F-22 is turning hard for next few seconds, and at 4:50, Rafale is directily behind the F-22 and has achieved the missile lock.
     
  12. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    [​IMG]


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    At 4:54, F-22 flies out of view and Rafale makes no attempt to follow; at 5:00, Rafale has returned to level flight, and at 5:23 Rafale pilot is heard requesting termination of engagement.

    As exercise was guns-only, missile kills were not counted. It is still clear that French statement about Rafale achieving several missile kills against the F-22 is correct. At around 4:40-40:50, Rafale seems to have missed an opportunity for a gun kill, but is otherwise mostly in control of the fight, with F-22 never gaining the initiative. Video does show that Rafale has good low-speed maneuvering performance and is capable of regaining lost energy at adequate rate.
     
    BON PLAN, Picard and ricky123 like this.
  13. BMD

    BMD Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    It was a gunfight DACT and the Rafale never had enough lead because it lacks energy. There is no claim of a French kill on an F-22 anywhere.
     
  14. BMD

    BMD Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    All the little dots are lesser aircraft, such as Rafales and F-16s.

    [​IMG]

    Show me kill markings on the Rafale of an EF.

    'Lethal combination'

    http://www.thefreedictionary.com/lethal

    [​IMG]
     
  15. BMD

    BMD Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Blog reporting = garbage. Rafale instantaneous TR is another unfounded assertion. Typhoon has a lower wing loading and higher T/W and CoP is more forward on CoG.

    Show me the same thing stated in a major aviation magazine, e.g. any of the following:

    Air Forces Monthly
    Air International
    Combat Aircraft
     

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