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France offers 25% discount to India on purchase of 36 Rafale jets

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by tusharm, May 6, 2015.

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  1. tusharm

    tusharm Captain FULL MEMBER

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    France offers 25% discount to India on purchase of 36 Rafale jets | Defenceradar News


    [​IMG]


    France agreed to a 25% discount on its earlier offer to clinch the deal for an off the-shelf purchase of 36 Rafale aircraft during Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s visit to Paris last month. This will be the base on which further negotiations will take place on Wednesday.

    The ballpark cost per aircraft as per Dassault’s winning bid for the 126 MMRCA programme — the old, nowscrapped, Rafale deal — came to about $300 million, taking into account the estimates ofHindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL). Sources told ET that the objective was to bring this down to a little over $200 million apiece.
    The overall cost is not expected to cross $8 billion for the entire 36-aircraft fleet, French sources said. MMRCA stands for medium multi-role combat aircraft.

    The price per aircraft is not just the acquisition cost of the platform, but also includes maintenance facilities, training of pilots and technicians, armaments and spares. In comparison, Dassault signed a deal withQatar on Monday to sell 24 Rafale fighters for $7 billion, which would put the per-aircraft cost at just over $290 million. India is set to get a better deal because of the larger number being ordered. It may be noted that the rival Eurofighter that was also in contention for the contract had offered India a 20% price cut after the new government took over.

    Besides the discount, France has agreed to undertake a longer maintenance schedule. The delivery of the first aircraft, according to the broad understanding reached at Paris, would take place in the next two-three years. France is believed to have pushed for a much larger off-the-shelf purchase with better concessions but New Delhi was wary of the impact this would have on the PM’s own Make in India initiative. The number, 36, was France’s bottom line in the negotiations. Before the visit, France had put its entire diplomatic weight behind striking a deal, which had got caught up in complications that would have translated into a cost escalation. This would have meant it would get reopened, further delaying the programme.

    Fresh negotiations began only after India made clear that the old deal was dead. This happened because the cost of the programme had swelled beyond all estimates owing to differences between Dassault and state-owned HAL on the manpower required to produce the aircraft. HAL had estimated that India would require 2.7 times the man hours that France uses for constructing the aircraft, putting the cost beyond negotiation.

    Source : Economic Times
    France offers 25% discount to India on purchase of 36 Rafale jets | Defenceradar News
     
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  2. tusharm

    tusharm Captain FULL MEMBER

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    Maybe now IAF will think of ordering LCA as they know the calculation

    1 x $300 million (Rafale) = 10 x LCA

    *Its total cost not just for fighter
     
  3. arulcharles

    arulcharles Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    There is no way LCA going to match the performance of rafale
     
  4. Ezco

    Ezco Captain FULL MEMBER

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    thanks you for this excellent comparaison, I add mine: 1 Rafale = 300 million kilos of apples
    If I were india I will purchase apples instead or Rafale. It is much more cheap.
     
  5. Ezco

    Ezco Captain FULL MEMBER

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    Can you explain us the calculation made by the journalist, as compared to MRCA:
    12 billion for 126 is about 95 million per rafale
    8 billion, for 36 is 220 million per plane.
     
  6. ersakthivel

    ersakthivel Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    There is no way IAF can justify the ten fold price difference, that too for a non stealth ,4.5 th gen fighter either, especially , when they are desperate about declining squadron strength!!!!
     
  7. ersakthivel

    ersakthivel Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Tell me which airfroce will shell out that much money for a 4.5th gen non stealth platform when they already have supersonic brahmos missile equipped SU-30 MKI options?
    If they do, then what will be the price demanded by russians from idia for their fully 5th gen FGFA?

    GOI has painted itself in the tightest corner possible, especially just before FGFA negotiations.
     
  8. tusharm

    tusharm Captain FULL MEMBER

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    The fact is that Rafale can't be used for building up sqd. numbers.

    The price comparison was for the point that for every 1 Rafale they can buy 10 LCA.
    The capability comparison will be done only by the idiots between the two as they are of different class , i hope nobody here is in that class(idiot).
     
  9. tusharm

    tusharm Captain FULL MEMBER

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    When MMRCA 126 Rafale were discussed weapons / field support etc were not part of it . Hence the calculation comes @ 95 million (if $12 billion)
    Now that we want to buy 36 it will come with its own weapons / spare engines etc .

    A2A missiles cost $2 m + (10/ fighter approx )
    Engines may cost $10m (2-4/fighter)
    Spares worth $2-3m maybe stocked.(yearly)
    A2G weapons will cost millions for each aircraft.(????????)

    So these extra costs add to per unit price of $220 mil
     
  10. positron

    positron Captain FULL MEMBER

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    And we might really purchase apples from Russia
     
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  11. positron

    positron Captain FULL MEMBER

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    There are few corrections here if you say the price is 200 million per plane
    One correction here, an aircraft uses up 5% of its price in spares each year that is general formula thus the spares will be 10 million a year
    Mica missiles (at least 4 per plane) those cost US$ 2.7 million a plane that is more than 10 million pe plane just MICA
    rest you can calculate
     
  12. sam2012

    sam2012 Captain FULL MEMBER

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    As IAF says squadron strength is depleteing hence they need low cost fighter

    On high end air superority and strike IAF has Su-30MKI , yes govt has ordered 36 rafale which is more political decision

    Let us not forget india is paying 40Million USD for upgrade and weapon system for Mirage 2000 , where they could have brought new LCA at that cost and gone for local upgrade of M2K similar to Mig-27

    In future rafale upgrade will cost more than cutrent unit cost no doubt
     
  13. somedude

    somedude Captain FULL MEMBER

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    That's funny.

    So, 200 millions per plane. With 10 millions for spares. Let's take five years of spares, that's 50 millions. So, it's 250 millions per plane, so that makes it 12.5 millions for spares, let's take five years of spares, that's 312 millions per plane, so spares cost 16 millions per year, so with five years of spare that gives 390 millions per plane, so ...


    Man the Rafale is really expensive when you keep adding up to its price things that were already added to its price!
     
  14. abhitej

    abhitej Captain SENIOR MEMBER

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    1 Rafale may not match 1 Tejas. But I am sure that 10 Tejas will outperform 1 Rafale. Why do you forget the price.
     
  15. Ezco

    Ezco Captain FULL MEMBER

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    to say than 1 Rafale equal to 10
    Outperform for which mission ? as soon as the target is too far the 10 LCA will all run out of fuel before to reach the target.
     
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