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France offers 25% discount to India on purchase of 36 Rafale jets

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by tusharm, May 6, 2015.

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  1. Paliwal Warrior

    Paliwal Warrior Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    MMRCA is dead

    but they are still linked via the MMRCA quote

    The prices Quoted under MMRCA is the Upper limit - the prices for 36 has ot be lesser than those under MMRCA

    now do you understand the link ?

    the costs for french airforce if they are above MMRCA quote will not apply
     
  2. randomradio

    randomradio Colonel REGISTERED

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    The rupee cost will increase if there is hike in specific price. Exchange rate does not vary because when the contract is signed a specific exchange rate is already pre-decided. This is done so major shock can be absorbed. In case the exchange rate changes a lot, new negotiations are held and another pre-determined rate is used.

    40000 Cr for 126 Rafales is impossible. That would peg the price below logical levels. The articles were clear when they stated the 40 Rafales will come at 40k cr. That's the price Brazil also got for their 36 Rafales. That was $8.2B with 30 years maintenance.

    For India, 40 Rafales at 8.8B is $220M per Rafale. That makes sense because it also includes weapons and 30 years maintenance.

    For Brazil, 36 Rafales at $8.2B is $230M per Rafale. That makes sense because it also includes weapons and 30 years maintenance.

    126 Rafales at 8.8B is $69M per Rafale. Impossible, especially with ToT and industrial production. It is declassified information that the 2007 bid came at $85M for each Rafale as just flyaway costs, that's $11B. ToT, industrial production etc not included.

    Now we are getting 36 Rafales at a price between $5 and 6B because that's the price France is paying for their Rafales.
     
  3. randomradio

    randomradio Colonel REGISTERED

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    This is from

    Video: Vayu-StratPost Air Power Roundtable II | StratPost
    Rafale is $85M.
     
  4. randomradio

    randomradio Colonel REGISTERED

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    Dude you logic has gone down the drain. GoI never confirmed the price. The media is making up the $10B amount.

    Look at my sources, Admiral Arun Prakash. What's your source?
     
  5. Paliwal Warrior

    Paliwal Warrior Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    85million *126 = 10.7 billion
    now apply 2010 exchange rate = 45 (as u yourself pointed out)

    1 billion = 4500 crore

    10.7 billion = 48150 crores

    whic is also the figure quoted in article no 3 i posted
     
  6. Paliwal Warrior

    Paliwal Warrior Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Doode

    Show me in the article where it is mentioned that 40 rafales are being offered at 40000 crores

    i have showed you atleast 5 articles where the costs are pegged at 40000-48000 crores for 126 rafales
     
  7. randomradio

    randomradio Colonel REGISTERED

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    That's flyaway cost. Not procurement cost or cost for maintenance, training, spares etc. Costs for ToT or industrial production are not included either.

    Just the flyaway cost is $10.7B. So dooode, read the fineprint.
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2015
  8. abhitej

    abhitej Captain SENIOR MEMBER

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    Read carefully this sentence in news article.

    "If we take the lowest value of $200 million, it will work out to around Rs 1,240 crore per aircraft. Even if we increase it to Rs 1,300 crore, it would be a better price than earlier," sources said.

    Point 1. Industry experts are saying price is between USD 200 - 220 million.

    Point 2. Defense source saying even if we taken lower range of price floating in market it will be around 1240 crores.

    Point 3. Defense source saying at 1300 crores the current price will be better than earlier price which was during MMRCA contract.

    It means that price quoted by Dassault in MMRCA was more than 1300 crores per plane.
     
  9. randomradio

    randomradio Colonel REGISTERED

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    All those articles are wrong. I have already presented the costs.
     
  10. Paliwal Warrior

    Paliwal Warrior Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    there is no such breakdown specified also the MMRCA deal includes ToT + 50% offsets + training of pilots & maintainance crews
    Industrial costs maybe extra

    it does not include long term maintainnace by Dasault & weapons
     
  11. Paliwal Warrior

    Paliwal Warrior Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    whoa

    all the article posted for 7 years are wrong and one articel misunderstood - either purposefully or unknowingly is right WOW

    Doodee
     
  12. randomradio

    randomradio Colonel REGISTERED

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    According to this unnamed source, Rafales are over 150K cr. According to Parrikar, Rafales are less than 100K cr. I'm pretty sure who I'm going to believe.
     
  13. randomradio

    randomradio Colonel REGISTERED

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    Shall I show you articles saying the MMRCA cost is $15B, shall I also show you some articles which say $20B, shall I also show you articles which say the cost if $25B, shall I also show you one which says $45B?

    GoI has never revealed the actual price. Only Parrikar says it is less than 100k cr. I would recommend sticking to that.

    Adm Prakash says cost of one Rafale jet is $85M. In his quote he also expects the total costs to be 120k Cr. So why does he make sense and you don't make sense?
     
  14. Paliwal Warrior

    Paliwal Warrior Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    if price quoted under MMRCA was more than 1300 crores for each

    it would costs 1300 *126 = 163800 crores = 25.60 billions at todays exchange rate of 64 rupees to dollar

    in terms of 2010 dollar exchange rate of 45 ruppes the deal value would be = 163800 /45 = 36.40 billion dollars

    does it make sense

    this is just a marketing Jhumla to sell the deal to people that we are getting it cheap

    while in reality we are giving exhorbitant price hikes to dasault
     
  15. Paliwal Warrior

    Paliwal Warrior Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    show me tha article which mentiones that Dasault offered 40 rafales for 40000 crores in 2010 specifically
    it should mention 40 rafales for 40000 crores
     
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