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Future "super destroyer",can India make it??

Discussion in 'Indian Navy' started by Indian Jatt, Mar 23, 2014.

  1. A_poster

    A_poster Captain FULL MEMBER

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    Power attenuation of lasers is very high, and they would not be used in anything except CIWS, if at all. Range missile defence would still be dependent on interceptor missiles.

    RailGun is the real gamechanging technology.
     
  2. Ripcord322

    Ripcord322 Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    @A_poster
    The point of stealth IS among other things to make the Enemy Ship Come Closer to Track you....So that in turn you have a better chance of hitting him....
    Let's just assume some hypothetical Numbers....
    Say RCS of Ship A is 10m^2 and
    RCS of Ship B is 50m^2
    And both ships are exactly the same otherwise....
    Obviously.... Ship A will detect Ship B beforehand, and has the luxury of exercising his options.... Ship B meanwhile doesn't know what's up... In a few minutes... 'ABANDON SHIP'....' ABANDON SHIP'.....
    Going Naked in the oceans these days....is 'dangerous' to say the least....

    While I agree that going full on 'ZUMWALT' on out next Destroyer might not be necessary.... (perhaps we don't even possess the capabilities to do so....) A good Offensive might as well cover the stealth shortcomings.... But it can only do so much....

    Indian Navy I believe is Realistic in Nature... They will work towards establishing a credible offence and defence against the PLAN which obviously is the Primary Threat... And A formidable one... I might add.....

    But IMHO the next generation of Destroyers will surely be more stealthy than our current ones....


    And 'Stealth' encompasses among other things... 'Acoustic', 'Radio', 'Thermal', 'Visual' Silence... And many other types.... It's a lot of work and surely should be researched upon....
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2016
  3. Ripcord322

    Ripcord322 Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    For lasers you need high amounts of Onboard power generation too.... The DRDO has demonstrated it's capabilities in this regard to an extent... The future is surely exciting.... This is a new Technology where we should jump right in, unlike the conventional technologies where other advance nations have decades of head start

    Is there a railgun project running somewhere in the country!?
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2016
  4. Indx TechStyle

    Indx TechStyle Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    We have tested a 10kW system called Dazzler already for targeting UAVs.
    Yup, many times was indicated, inside Indian Navy's plan 2031 but the only publicized thing was just a research paper published on BRF.:)
    http://indiandefence.com/threads/future-super-destroyer-can-india-make-it.44537/page-10#post-514544
     
  5. HariPrasad

    HariPrasad Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    We need to start design and work on technologies. We need to collaborate with different countries like Israel and Russia so that when all technologies matures, we may integrate them into a single platform. In all likelyhood, We shall have QR SAM/ Maitri, EX SAM, Hypersonic Brahmos, 100 KW Laser, Nirbhay naval version ready by 2022. So we must start making the platform in such a way that they all are ready at same time and we may get an operational super destroyer by 2024 or latest by 2026 and then this class of destroyer may follow 1 every year like project 15 A. However, we need a very closer look at whether these technology and this kind of destroyer will be required at that time or not. It should not happen that we may make it and concept becomes out dated because of any reason that time.
     
  6. HariPrasad

    HariPrasad Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Agni 6 may not be required on this platform. Better we may have K5 instead if required at all.
     
  7. HariPrasad

    HariPrasad Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    No there shall not be only 16 brahmos. It will be atleast 32. Add maitri/ QR SAM also.
     
  8. HariPrasad

    HariPrasad Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    RAIL Gun appears to be a distance dream but Laser seems definitely possible.
     
  9. HariPrasad

    HariPrasad Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    But may not be brahmos 2 it will be laser proof.
     
  10. Gessler

    Gessler Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

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    I made that post over 2 years ago and the situation was different then. Today, a Project-18 DDG appears very feasible by 2030.

    As of the missiles, it depends. I'm all in for over 16 ASCMs, but if what I heard is correct (upto 32 dedicated cells for LACMs), it doesn't really warrant a need for more than 16 ASCM units. We need to consider that today, the P-15A Kolkata-class has 16 strike-length cells for BrahMos Block-I, and these 16 have to manage surface warfare AND land-attack duties. And that's already twice the firepower of comparable DDGs like Type-052C. Once ship-based Nirbhay is realized, it will free up all 16 of these cells for a complete surface-dominance role. Count in the fact that BrahMos-2K Scramjet ASCM will be online by that time, and you have probably one of the most lethal surface-warfare capabilities in the world, if not the most lethal.

    However, if it turns out that we'll be going for 64 strike-length cells (32 AS, 32 LA), I'm totally cool with that.

    QRSAM is possible, as a replacement for the Barak-1 PDMS across the fleet. MBDA Maitri appears to be dead.
     
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  11. DEBA

    DEBA IDF NewBie

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    We can go for around 20000 ton cruiser to accompany INS VIKRAMADIDYA & INS VIKRANT . Such a ship equipped with 1 battery S 500 ( naval version ) , 1 battery S 400 , 6 Barrack 8 ( 48 VLS ), 16 MBDA Aster 15 , 16 Aster 30 , 48 Akash VLS to cover Lomg - medium & short range air & missile defence .. newly tested Maitri QR SAM & 4 Kasthan / phalanx with 2 Ak 630 as CIWS. Given the range of S 500 & S 400 this ship can provide an umbrella of more than 15000 sq. km for other ship of the group. To engage into real maritime combat there would be 96 VLS , 32 each for BrahMos , Zircon & Kalibr ( 3M - 14 ). 4 RBU - 6000 smerch 2 ASW rocket launcher , 2 ASW helicopter & 2 utility helicopter , Kavach Decoy , 16 tubes for light & heavy torpedos.
    4 such nuclear propelled cruiser & may be heavier cruiser like KIROV class of Russia may be helpful in future. Advent of hypersonic long range missiles will gain more accuracy in coming days making life difficult for ACs. Once hypersonic LR - SAMS arrives fighter jets might become museum object. Cruisers with size of 1/4 to 1/3 of an US super carrier having extreme fire power more agile & maneuverable , cheaper & easier to maintain also requires lesser number of crew would rule the sea again. Russia is bringing back Admiral Nakimov & designed Lider class ( 17500 - 20000 ton ) cruiser for future.

    Smaller ships of Indian Navy like project 15a & 15b destroyers , project 17a frigates , project 28a corvettes are too good to defend Indian Maritime interest closer to shore & Indian ocean region but they need those big guys to accompany in a real threat environment south china sea.
     
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  12. Austerlitz

    Austerlitz Extraordinary Historian THINKER

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    We don't have the budget for this yet.Another 10-15 years.We don't need enormous ships as our navy operating in IOR will be supported by land based infrastructure and aircraft.What we do need are permanently stationed brahmos regiment in andaman.A fully functioning airfield there with hardened shelters.A seabed sensor system co-operating and integrated with us -japanese SOSUS network.And finally - get the Goddman naval ASW helicopters and torpedoes for submarines.We shouldn't try to operate more then 2 carriers now.

    Navy has least budget allocation,if IAF couldn't afford more than 36 rafale..how the hell is navy supposed to afford a nuke carrier and 57 rafales or 5th gen.Its not feasible now.

    We also need to get better use out of our existing ship models.The 3000 ton OPVs need to have a secondary anti ship capability,there is enough space for 8 brahmos at least and a rudimentary aaa capability.
    The kamorta class needs heavier weapons load for its size- RBU as a offensive ASW weapon is obsolete,too small range,only good for hardkill torpedoes if they get warning.We need something like the ASROC or the russian ASW kalibr variant for standoff kills.We should get the second one or the new russian Paket-NG dual purpose ASW system.


    Same with kolkata class - wtf is 32 BARAK-8 missile load.There is space for 64 missiles,we need to use it ASAP.I'm completely disappointed to see vishakapatnam with same load.
    Finally,good thing we are not getting any new talwars.Its already undergunned,just compare it with the new russian gorshkov class.Now thats a beast of a frigate pound for pound.And please get rid of the shitty shtil arm launchers during mid life refit of shivalik and talwars.These are obsolete and useless against saturation attacks of high volume.
     
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  13. Anish

    Anish BANNED BANNED

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    The Navy should work on deploying Dhanush alongside the short range P-800(Brahmos) on upcoming vessels.


    And focus more on submarines.

    Surface wise I think Navy is over equipped
     
  14. Shekhar Singh

    Shekhar Singh 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Only son in law can make.
     
  15. GSLV Mk III

    GSLV Mk III Captain FULL MEMBER

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    Your wish is granted. (well not exactly, but they are working on it)

    Ministry of Defence
    (07-February, 2017 16:40 IST )

    Special Innovative Defence Projects

    Some of the new special innovative projects undertaken by Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) during last three years are:

    · Supersonic Missile Assisted Release of Torpedo (SMART)

    http://pib.nic.in/newsite/mbErel.aspx?relid=158187


    I guess it wouldn't be difficult to replace the RBU 6000 with the Indian ASROC, given the underdeck penetration of the RBU.

    I believe the Shivaliks may be upgraded with the MF-STAR Barak 8 combo. There are unconfirmed reports of the same.

    Considering the present level of utilization of DPSU shipyards, we wouldn't see this in anything less than 10 years. The last two P17As will be launched only by 2022, so adding at least five years for construction- if they immediately start construction that is...
     
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