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IAF Chronicles - A side view of whats going on behind the closed doors in New Delhi

Discussion in 'Defence Analysis' started by PARIKRAMA, Jul 15, 2017.

  1. Bloom 17

    Bloom 17 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    So far GOI has been doing the right opposite. They preach one thing while doing another. let's hope you are right.
     
    PARIKRAMA likes this.
  2. stephen cohen

    stephen cohen Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    For LCA to succeed it will have to Fight a Mock Air battle with F 16 or Gripen

    DRDO will have to take the battle to the media and public

    Let DRDO challenge IAF and Lockheed and SAAB

    As it happened for T 90 VS Arjun Comparative Trials

    Still Arjuns Weight Issues could not be resolved ; Forget it
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2017
    PARIKRAMA likes this.
  3. ranadd

    ranadd 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Oh, are we still on this? Did anyone say import lobby will be defeated?

    Please.

    Anything in India is for sale for the right price. Anything. Indians have this mentality that governemnt properties and affairs are free or not of their concern.

    LCA like Arjun should have been the posters for Made In India.

    And to all the “experts” do you have any idea what it would mean if LCA is finally produced after all this drama and bad press??

    Remeber Tata Nano?

    Right marketing and positive outlook should be present for the end users.
     
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  4. stephen cohen

    stephen cohen Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Nano is a failed Product ; Its production has been stopped

    We will still have 123 LCAs ; Not more than that
    And then Wait for A Twin Engined Stealthy AMCA
     
    Shekhar Singh likes this.
  5. ranadd

    ranadd 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    My friend, I used to and still have more access to personnel in Indian Industry and MIC than you may assume.

    On topic:

    Nano as a product met all the requirements. I would like you to find out why it failed.

    123 orders made including LRIP ones.

    Let us visit the number after 5 years.

    AMCA hehehehe... ok buddy.
     
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  6. lca-fan

    lca-fan Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    Nano is not a failed product...... But was killed by other car companies by bribing that mamta di.......... Same is being done foreign fighter companies.

    It was conceived to be the cheapest car and was one of the best car at that price point (Rs 100,000) but Tatas had shift their plant from Bengal to Sanand Gujarat and that cost and losses incurred had to be transferred to the cost of car which raised its cost to at par with other bigger cars along with time consumed to re-establish product brand and long waiting period made customers shift their choice.........
     
  7. stephen cohen

    stephen cohen Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Tata Nano may soon be phased out in India: Report

    Tata Motors may soon stop investing in Nano which was launched by Ratan Tata in 2009 as the ‘world’s cheapest car’, according to a ‘Business Line’ report

    http://www.livemint.com/Companies/b...Motors-may-soon-phase-out-Nano-for-India.html
     
  8. bharathp

    bharathp Developers Guild Developers -IT and R&D

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    the above is exactly whats going on from a layman's perspective. I believe you both (@PARIKRAMA and @vstol_jockey) both have your own sources probably more reliable than the media reports, but it seems both of you have two different opinions formed from the same sources.

    the LCA was never intended to be an f-16 or Gripen from its day 1 avatar. it is already so much more better than the lowest end "newer" fighters that one of our principal adversaries is fielding (JF-17). it will do well enough to defend from JF-17's and in numbers, it can probably counter the f-16s.

    The LCA is also the only way we have our own test bed for all things related to developing the sub components of fighter aircraft and hopefully - catching up with the rest of the world at some point in the future.

    given the above points are just absolutely "no contest" points that we can never get with a foreign fighter, why would there be any murmur of the IAF NOT wanting the LCA?

    the article clearly says that LCA is not "enough" to protect Indian skies. which EVERYONE KNOWS. I mean - LCA wont replace MKI, Jags or M2Ks for sure. its not in the same damn class either. then why this furore every few weeks vilifying the LCA? where do these come from?
     
  9. stephen cohen

    stephen cohen Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    So if HAL / DRDO is not able to deliver the Promised MK 1 A ; whose fault is it

    MK 1 A was first announced in 2015 ; to be delivered in 2018

    http://www.business-standard.com/ar...rce-to-buy-tejas-mark-1-a-115081201951_1.html

    2017 is over ; what is the Progress

    Why Blame IAF if HAL / DRDO dont fulfill their promises
     
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  10. randomradio

    randomradio Colonel Technical Analyst

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    Karnad again. He's made up shit as usual. The only thing right was the thing about endurance.
     
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  11. bharathp

    bharathp Developers Guild Developers -IT and R&D

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    forget about the progress, there is not even a whimper these days.
    earlier we had a mouthing off from DRDO/HAL every few weeks on how awesome work they are doing and how the defence forces are to blame for changing the requirements every few years.(remember the unmanned LCA, the conversion of Chetak helis to unmanned, the claims of LCA beating everything in the world - okay am exaggerating a bit)

    right now, it seems more like radio silence except for media reports from "sources". who knows what these "sources" are and what to believe from them.

    and then we have defence enthusiast bloggers with their own agendas.

    from the govt's own words though, the monies for Tejas Mk II were sanctioned in 2009 - (AF version) - so I do not know how we get to the point "Mk 2 is nver going to happen - Mk 2 is Mk 1A". can someone please enlighten my puny brain?
     
  12. randomradio

    randomradio Colonel Technical Analyst

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    The first version of Tejas was supposed to be a Mig-21 replacement only. But in the mid 90s that changed. It became a "M-2000 equivalent" with the addition of the digital FBW, multi-mode radar, advanced EW etc. You will notice that test pilots constantly compare it to the M-2000.

    The idea was LCA will fill in the requirement of M-2000, at least what the ADA hoped it would be with follow on versions. They assumed IAF would buy 300+ LCAs in two different versions.

    That's a principle reason why GoI stopped MRCA with F-16 , M-2000 and Gripen and started MMRCA with Rafale, Typhoon etc. We lost about 5 years doing that.

    A lot of our procurement issues is because ADA failed to deliver.
     
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  13. stephen cohen

    stephen cohen Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    With its Limited Combat Radius LCA will be able to Point defence and CAP Duties
    So 123 LCAs will replace the 120 Mig 21s Still left

    But we have to also Replace Mig 27 and Jaguars at some Point

    There comes the Role for Either F 16
    or More Rafales or More Sukhois if Nothing else is possible

    Also we need a larger Air force for a two Front Situation ( 55 Squadrons )
     
    Hellfire likes this.
  14. WhyCry

    WhyCry Reaper Love Developers -IT and R&D

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    55 Squadrons?? You are even faster than IAF who are insisting on 45.
     
  15. bharathp

    bharathp Developers Guild Developers -IT and R&D

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    <rant begins>
    55 sqdns?

    of the sanctioned sqdns itself we created ourselves a logistical nightmare. think of the supply chain required to maintain this beast of inventory:
    6-7 (123 ) Desi LCA
    6-7 (126) French Rafale
    13 (272) Russian MKI
    6-7 (126) American F-16
    3-4 (60) Jaguar (UK/France)

    34 -38 Sqdns

    once more sqdns are sanctioned, our dear planners will go:
    missing peices:
    3-4 Japanese,
    3-4 korean sqns

    then if left parties win the election they will go "we need a political deal with China, lets dangle a carrot to them and buy chinese and aircraft"
    4-5 chinese aircraft sqns
    </rant ends>

    sorry - couldnt help.

    this "political deals" entangled with "buying that countries military equipment" is going against defense preparedness and indigenization

    looks like we have 3 things:
    1) political deals
    2) defense preparedness
    3) indigenization

    we can only pick 2 of the above.
     
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