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India Doesn’t Require F-16s When it Has Tejas

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by layman, Mar 31, 2017.

  1. zebra7

    zebra7 Captain FULL MEMBER

    Nov 3, 2016
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    Those experience of 30 years were not for the BVR engagement, and pls answer does IAF have better experience with the BVR doctorine and tactics (When did PAF got its first BVR capability). Does IAF pilots are clocking more flying hour training than PAF counterpart owing to more resources or not? Does IAF aircrafts are maintained by the U.S or other counties technicians, and is bound with the deal for any time, 24X7 aircraft inspection. Don't their Pilots retired. Don't only few lucky Pilots got chance to train on F-16, which is small in number, of the airforce which is cash strapped and training and flying cost spares, fuel, lubrication, maintenance etc plus they are taking lot of stress in the A2G operations.

    BTW they got 18 block 52, and rest are just F-16 A and B, which are upgraded by Turkey with U.S supplied Kits and those upgrades didn't cover the Engine replacement which have already most of their TSL life and are stressed for Zarb-e-azb ops., only the airframe have been strengthened. Nor they can use non U.S weapons/equipment on those aircraft, nor they can modify them, nor they can deploy them in any base across Pakistan other than few specified base and PAF F-16 are squezed out due and stressed due to ongoing operation of the so called op against terror aka arb-e-bakwas because making hue cry with Chinese FC-1, and painted green JF-17 is good for only tossing free fall bomb droping capability . The real threat to the IAF is the AWAAC, which PAf have acquired from Sweden and China and IAF will have to nullify this factor first, and that's why S400 deal is making them nervous.

    They didn't but did IAF have experience in facing against F-16 or not, though pilots are of different origin but both are trained by USAF?

    • They have HMS, but for how many aircraft ?
    • How many aircraft of them have IRST Sensor?
    • Do they have Programable Jammers? How many types of BVRAAM does India uses, thus how many countermeasures against the active AAM does PAF will face.
    • What is the difference between AIM-9 and AIM-9X ? and does HOBS missile could help in short range engagement aka dogfight?
    But so far PAF has the advantage here !!! How against whom ? MIG 21 Bison ?? Janab that is an interceptor, and is not meant to do engage in short range dogfight, rather for high speed interception aka chasing and striking, and an MIG 21 bison armed with IIR AAM and cued to the intercepting PAF aircraft by the ground radar unit, from the Back is more than enough since no active radar is needed which will warn the F-16s RWS or MAWS. OR the Mig 29UPG which have superior rate of climb, more egile, armed with IRST, and deadly R73 which could be fired from high bore angle, and after upgrades got the internal AESA based Virgilius jammer. Or against MKI -- which outclass it in all department, with superior detection, thrust, long range BVR, and range.

    They got AWAC support but how many of their bases provide them ground support. An initial salvo of Brahmos, will render them useless. Also just look at the Indo-Israel DEW based on Spice family to burn all electronics with EMP shock. With S400 induction, during hostility, the PAF would be forced to reroute their AWACS deeper close to Afghanistan border, and that would reduce their surveillance, air battle management capability.

    In short

    Does IAF could do SEAD, DEAD, Air Superiority Against PAF -- Yes
    Does IAF could do preemptive strike against PAF -- Not at present but after Rafale, Super sukhoi upgrade, and DEW weapon -- Yes.

    Does PAF could do SEAD, DEAD, Air Superiority against IAF -- No because unlike past 3d/4D and Airborne Radar defeat low altitude terrain following, long range
    Does PAF could do preemptive strike against IAF like she did in the past -- Hell No
    Does PAF could strike Indian bases from standoff distance -- Yes but in limited range from the Pakistani own strand-off airspace.

    Does PAF could fight defensive Air war in its own airspace -- Yes -- But that will give India the advantage of engaging PAF in its own term, time, and place of choosing do engage them.

    LOL, What makes you think that India would agree for less. And for CAS you don't need F-16 block 60/62. For Air Defence Role we already have strong SAM network and MKI, Mirage 2k5, and Mig 29UPG. For ground attack role, AESA radar provides interleaved operation aka A2A scanning, and Ground SAR mode operation simultaneously.


    BTW lot of kits are available off the shelf at cheaper rates to convert the dump bomb into glide bomb now a days.

    You wrongly interpreted my statement. What I means was that during the peace time most of the planes of IAF are stationed deep inside the country like Varanasi, Gwalior and would use those forward bases only for the refueling/re-amunition arming during the night and only sport Mig 21 at present, and would be replaced by LCA in future. They are meant for CAS and short notice scrambling during any air space breach. For an attack on that Airbases SAMs are present, but to attack those bases, the enemy could safely lodge glide bomb from safer distance, without indulging with IAF and dealing with SAMs.
  2. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel IDF NewBie

    May 3, 2011
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    Of course not, but that's only a specific part of the training, the point however remains that they have more experience with the fighter in general, while the technical advantages the version offered to us, doesn't make it much more useful.

    The rest of your post is mixing up a lot of unretalted stuff and speculation, but I suggest to check your info's on JF 17, because they actually are the biggest threat to India and offer far more capabilities than the F16's.

    I never said we would agree, but that it can't be used for deepstrikes and the limitation of the US to provide such weapons made the European fighters always more interesting with actual cruise missiles on offer.
  3. Boomslang

    Boomslang IDF NewBie

    Nov 14, 2016
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    Dude You have totally been unsighted by the fact that the F-16 is American and anything American is good The F-16 is a late 60s airframe designed for times before we were born when North Vietnamese Migs were swatting Phantoms out of the skies. This airframe is still the same design and material though the avionics and engine have evolved and changed with time. The USA sees rapidly diminishing returns on it so it is trying to palm it off to the Indians for the few spares it might need before the F-16 fleet is replaced with F-22s largely or F-35s. I have been trying to highlight this issue along with the fact that every highly regarded self-sufficient fighter manufacturing country has had to go through what India is going through with its' fighters and other aircrafts and helicopters Indian avionics and armament are tied to these flying machines that will find no use and be dumped. Which idiot in India does not understand that irrespective of the so called" foreign policy" advantage (largely perceived: the USA and every man jack of its' armed forces considers India to be a backward country and with the F-16 deal they will think India is Stupid AND backward) No matter who loses how much in graft and the few possible issues it might face during its' operational life, India will benefit hugely in the coming years. New designs cropping out of the experience will have stunning advantage over anything India can procure from outside. The Fat Admiral who spoke about the LCA being heavy should be investigated for graft then deep sixed for saying such a thing. Indians should be able to benefit from numbers something that they will not be able to do with costly foreign aircrafts. India needs to stick out one generation of the LCA only even then it appears Mark Upgrades are in the offing. Someone's feeding the Indian PM wrong kinda crap. Stop that stupid MRCA tender go with more Sukhois and The LCA.. That should be the mantra. Even valid for Pakistan and their homegrown Aircrafts too...
    surya kiran likes this.

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