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India Planning to procure Malaysian Mig-29N?

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by layman, Mar 27, 2017.

  1. Grevion

    Grevion Professional Think Troll IDF NewBie

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    It's a matter of what 2-3 years till we start receiving Rafale and Tejas mk1a in good nos to replace mig 21 and 27s. The UPG programme is gonna cost $900 million for the IAF fleet of 69 migs that's roughly $13.5 million per aircraft apart from that the amount we will pay for the procurement of Malaysian migs and the time it will take for such negotiations the super mkis still looks a more viable option to fill in the capacity gap.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2017
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  2. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

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    Yes that's why I said that Qatari M2Ks would be the fastest option. MKIs are too costly and would need more time too.
     
  3. MilSpec

    MilSpec Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    they just have 10 aircraft if I am not mistaken. Do you know which type these are?
     
  4. MilSpec

    MilSpec Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    I was really hoping that getting the rafales would have somehow ensured the M2k's sale to India.
     
  5. layman

    layman Aurignacian STAR MEMBER

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    India Keen to Buy MiG-29 from Malaysia
    (Source: New Straits Times; published April 5, 2017)

    NEW DELHI --- India has stated its keenness to buy the MiG-29 aircraft from Malaysia and upgrade them for use by its air force.

    Prime Minister Datuk Seri Najib Razak said the proposal was among the aspects of military cooperation agreed to by Malaysia and India.

    In this matter, he said the Ministry of Defence and the Royal Malaysian Air Force (TUDM) would look at the form of cooperation, including handling the Sukhoi aircraft and spare parts.

    "There is a possibility too that they will buy our MiG 29 aircraft for refit. We reciprocate by accepting spare parts for our Sukhoi aircraft programme," he told a media conference at the end of a six-day visit to India which started on March 30 in Chennai.

    According to leading military aviation magazine, 'Air Forces Monthly', the Royal Malaysian Air Force in 1995 procured 18 MiG-29N from Russia, and presently has 10 MiG-29N and 2 MiG-29NU (trainers) in its fleet.

    Najib also said the visit this time to India was successful in terms of investments between the two countries, whereby 31 memoranda of understanding (B-to-B) had been signed with investments totalling US$35.99 billion (RM159.26 billion).

    The cooperation encompassed construction of harbours and roads, development of solar energy, smart city, palm oil and coconut, technology park and higher education.

    In addition, Topworth Group and Samarth Group from India had submitted their Letters of Intent to invest US$380 million (RM1.6 billion) in Malaysia, he added.

    He said Samarth Group, which is a manufacturer of critical medical products, planned to invest US$80 million (RM352 million) in Iskandar Malaysia, Johor, while Topworth, an aluminium foil manufacturer for packaging medicine, was keen to invest US$300 million (RM1.32 billion) in Bintulu, Sarawak.

    Najib also said Malaysia was striving to obtain six highway construction packages totalling 3,000 km in Rajashtan involving an estimated investment of US$1.5 billion (RM6.5 billion).

    "My visit to Jaipur showcases Malaysia's keenness on the highway project in Rajashtan and the model to be implemented by Malaysia will be an example to the states neighbouring Rajashtan," he said.

    Source
     
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  6. layman

    layman Aurignacian STAR MEMBER

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    India to send a team to examine whether to acquire MiG-29 jets from Malaysia
    Published April 7, 2017
    SOURCE: PTI

    [​IMG]
    Malaysian air force MIG-29N

    A committee of defence experts will examine whether to consider buying MiG-29 fighter jets from Malaysia and upgrade them for use by Indian Air Force.At the end of his visit here, Malaysian Prime Minister Najib Razak had said India is keen to buy MiG-29 fighter jets from his country and upgrade them for use by IAF.

    Government sources said a committee of experts will examine the issue following which a decision may be arrived at.Najib had said the proposal was among the aspects of military cooperation agreed to by Malaysia and India during his visit to New Delhi and talks with Prime Minister Narendra Modi.

    He said the India’s Ministry of Defence and the Royal Malaysian Air Force (TUDM) would look at the form of cooperation, including handling the Sukhoi aircraft and spare parts.

    “There is a possibility too that they (India) will buy our MiG 29 aircraft for refit. We reciprocate by accepting spare parts for our Sukhoi aircraft programme,” he was quoted as saying by Bernama news agency.

    According to leading military aviation magazine, ‘AirForces Monthly’, the Royal Malaysian Air Force in 1995 procured 18 MiG-29N from Russia, and presently has 10 MiG-29N and 2 MiG-29NU (Trainers) in its fleet.

    Source
     
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  7. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

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    From layman's article:

    The question remains how much they are asking. Our government doesn't seem to look for expensive / capable alternatives.

    36 Rafales instead of 126
    Underperforming LCA Mk1A instead of LCA MK2
    So Malaysian Migs instead of possibly more expensive Qatari M2Ks wouldn't be that surprising, but let's keep hoping.
     
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  8. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

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    Not directly related and just a thought, but if IAF would be ok with 2nd hand Migs, couldn't IN's Mig 29Ks be a solution too?

    We bought 45 of them, so providing IAF with 36 to fill 2 squads is possibly the fastest replacement option IAF has right now. They know the Migs, have pilots and logistics available, so no issue in inducting them either.

    The Migs in IN then could be replaced with a single larger order of carrier fighters for both STOBAR carriers.
     
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  9. Bregs

    Bregs Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    There were reports regarding dismally low availability of newly inducted MIG 29K and now India looking for second hand MIG 29N, is this the wise move ?
     
  10. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

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    Well we know that they are not the most reliable fighters, but they are relatively cheap and thanks to the long experience in IAF, fast and easy to induct.
     
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  11. layman

    layman Aurignacian STAR MEMBER

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    I guess Malaysian Mig's have done only 1800 hours in total per Mig's on average so there is considerable amount of service lifespan left and RMAF are anyways going to decommission it and India can get it dead cheap and has capacity to upgrade to UPG version adding another 2000 hours service lifespan.

    it would be a steal though for the money India will shell out as India is negotiating for service as well of their planes.

    Indian Naval Mig's dont have service lifespan much and configuration can be adjusted though.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2017
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  12. MilSpec

    MilSpec Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    that was due to lack of service crew in the IN. Not the platforms fault. Mig29, MKi and Mirages are more or less technologically advanced systems for the IAF which for ages operated the previous gen fighters and a bulk of those were the Mig21, pretty much the AK47 of the aircraft world, extremely rugged, extremely easy to maintain. For the MKI HAL and IAF both have to take the blame. IAF's BRD's are a horrid organisation and HAL's after-sales support is next to nothing.

    M2K and Jag's on the other hand were inherently simple to maintain, and had been designed for ease of maintenance.

    So is not the case for MKI and Mig29. Just trouble shooting a failed analog sensor and tracking it back through the wiring harness is a nightmare. With MKI we atleast have spare engines at koraput, that's not the case with Mig29, where IAF has a safety stock but IN doesn't and I am not sure if thy have still been able to build a sustainable Supply chain depot for spares.

    For the Malaysian Mig29's, they are a good idea for the Indian Air Force, So are additional M2K's if we can get the qatari ones. Some high brows might smirk at the word second hand, but the bottom line is Mig29's are an extremely potent Air superiority Platform. IAF has a moderately effective maintenance regimen to sustain the system. 15-18 more systems would definitely be a shot in the arm for the forces, especially the two seat trainers would bring unprecedented value to the fleet.
     
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  13. Grevion

    Grevion Professional Think Troll IDF NewBie

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    AFAIK the Russians won't allow any other aircraft to be operated from vicky. So no Rafales or Sea Gripens the replacement must be a Russian one.
     
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  14. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

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    Configuration wouldn't need to be changed, since they are technically (apart of the engine) equal to IAFs Mig29 UPG.

    They wouldn't sell the carrier without Russian aircrafts, but now it belongs to us and we can use it like we want. We operate western and Indian helicopters from it already.
    The only problem is, which fighter is suitable to our carriers, with size and performance limitations.
     
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  15. Grevion

    Grevion Professional Think Troll IDF NewBie

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    It might be more complicated then that. India needs Russian help for any upgrades/changes in the deck based systems for Vicky to be able to operate with a non-Russian origin aircraft. Russia won't allow that. @vstol jockey
     

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