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Indian Navy looks for heavyweight torpedoes for submarines

Discussion in 'Indian Navy' started by Agent_47, Aug 22, 2017.

  1. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog Staff Member MODERATOR

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    The Indian Navy is issuing fresh ‘request for information’ (RFI) to five international companies for 150 heavyweight torpedoes for submarines at a cost of $300 million.

    The Indian Navy is issuing fresh ‘request for information’ (RFI) to five international companies for 150 heavyweight torpedoes for submarines at a cost of $300 million. Sources told FE that the RFIs have been sent to French company Naval Group (formerly known as DCNS), German ThyssenKrupp, Swedish SAAB, Rosoboronexport (Russia) and a Japanese company. “Earlier, the original RFI for the heavy torpedoes was for 98, now the numbers are in bulk. The idea is to buy initial and the rest will be under ‘Make in India’ with an Indian partner,” said the source. These torpedoes are very important for the submarines and when India gets INS Kalvari, the first Scorpene class stealth submarine built under Project 75, later this year, it will be ‘without’ heavyweight torpedoes. This submarine is currently undergoing extensive sea trials.

    Work is expected to start on INS Khanderi, the second indigenous Scorpene-class submarine, which was recently launched at MDL. These are conventional diesel-electric subs made by DCNS (Naval Group) of France. Long delays in the Scorpene (project 75) at MDL, which was intended to induct the vessels at the rate on one ship per year since 2012, have left the submarine force well below the requisite levels.

    Early this year, the government cancelled its previous contract to buy 98 Black Shark heavyweight torpedoes from – Whitehead Alenia Systemi Subacquei (WASS) – a subsidiary of the Italian defence group Finmeccanica. It may be recalled that the group was blacklisted after it was alleged that another subsidiary of the company – AgustaWestland – had paid bribes to secure a contract to sell 12 medium-lift helicopters to India.

    The foreign companies have to select their partners in India as the torpedoes are expected to be made here under the Strategic Partnership Model. The Modi-led NDA government is keen to reduce India’s dependence on foreign equipment manufactures. It has opened up defence manufacturing to Indian private sector. The SP route envisages that the Indian private companies will tie-up with foreign manufactures to get technology and in return the government will assure orders and allow exports as well.

    http://www.financialexpress.com/ind...-heavyweight-torpedoes-for-submarines/818181/

    @Abingdonboy @Sancho @Gessler @randomradio
     
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  2. sunstersun

    sunstersun Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Rooting for Japan.
     
  3. Ankit Kumar 001

    Ankit Kumar 001 Major Technical Analyst

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    Sweden with SAAB , Germany with TKMS and French are the real contenders....
     
  4. Hellfire

    Hellfire Devil's Advocate Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Oh no ... IN is also sold now, eh? Like members here lambast any foreign purchase

    What happened to to Varunastra? How will our industry grow if we buy 'phoren maal'?
     
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  5. vstol jockey

    vstol jockey Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    Varunastra is already inducted for ships and being converted to sub launch role. Have patience, IN does not sabotage any Indian Maal but in fact supports them in every possible manner. Once the sub launched Varunastra is ready, it will be deployed alongside the imported ones.
     
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  6. Hellfire

    Hellfire Devil's Advocate Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Sir.

    1 year, still not been configured for subs? It has been accepted for production already.

    Wonder who is lying?

    http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/...rpedo-submarines-mtcr-lca-tejas/1/883780.html



    So, perhaps, suboptimal performance/stabilisation of systems is underway? If that be the case, why not wait till it is 'ironed' out? Maybe a year or two, but we will surely get there.

    Or is it because it takes time and these are critically needed to ensure effective deployability? Especially in present circumstances?

    Is that a valid rationale here?

    What are your views on the Il-78s which remain grounded due to non-sanction of Hangars by the MoD and MoF for the same and got damaged extensively during the hale storm in Agra? What of the critical deficiency that has crept in with the acquisition hanging in air till date while the RM (both Antony and the one who followed it) played 'Cold Feet' over single vendor situation?

    http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...fuellers-IAF-to-govt/articleshow/50711370.cms

    Are you aware of the latest gem? The DPSUs have claimed they will make an airborne refueller and AWACS combined into 1 ... a bloody two in one!!! They are planning on trying it with A-330!!!!

    @PARIKRAMA This last piece I forgot to mention .. I almost choked on this one. Apparently this stupidity has also been dreamt up ;) @nair
     
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  7. lca-fan

    lca-fan Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    Really Aplaudable I would say :respect::respect::respect::respect:

    This could be discovery of a century in Military Aviation and proves our DiPSUs have come of age. :sarcastic::sarcastic::sarcastic::sarcastic:

    :crazy::crazy::crazy::crazy::crazy: fellows...............
     
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  8. kaku

    kaku Major Technical Analyst

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    Firstly, this is only a RFI. Secondly, this is for submarine, not for ships. If the whole submarine is foreign maal, then what are other options?

    Also Varunastra is not a wire guided torpedo.

    [​IMG]

    Here is the torpedo, under development for submarine.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2017
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  9. Notsuperstitious

    Notsuperstitious 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Billion dollar destroyers, frigates and subs without million dollar torpedoes, ASW helicopters and towed array sonars.

    Planning.
     
  10. Hellfire

    Hellfire Devil's Advocate Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Redundant. We have tonnes of threads here over intent and accusation of corruption to selling out the nation. So am trying to start the same here.. Let us have some similarity in the shallowness of our approach, paint everyone other than us as corrupt and morally bankrupt and then tom tom mere ideas as working platforms ... and berate the forces again ...



    So? Varunastra is ready for submarines - DRDO said so! :D

    That is pretty lame .. that is what an excuse will be given by OFB when asked why the T-72s APFSDs are being imported till date when the ToT for the same is with them and they claim they make them!



    Is the RFI for wire guided? Are wire guided better than active/passive homing? Also I hope we are talking of Project Varunastra? Thakshak is a variant of the same! And that has dual mode, both wire and autonomous guidance?
     
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  11. kaku

    kaku Major Technical Analyst

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    This is not like, India is corruption free. Whenever acquisition go haywire, people indeed say something is not right. What you expect from common people? I can give you few example for such
    Example 1:
    [​IMG]
    Great Museum of IPKF's T-72 in Sri Lanka.

    Example 2:
    On Brajesh Mishra

    If you want more example, I can give more.


    Fact is, it is not.

    That is not a lame excuse, Scorpene is a proprietary of France and 877 is of Russia. You cant fire a different torpedo from a submarine without making some changes including hardware and software.

    And such changes cant be made without informing those OEM. And there are no reasons why such OEM accept such changes.



    Obviously.
    I am not talking about what wiki say, but what DRDO say. And until they only claim autonomous guidance perfected in Varunastra, and all torpedoes that sold to IN use autonomous guidance, none is wire guided.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2017
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  12. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

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    1. You don't ask a sub manufacturer for information on the licence production of torpedos.
    2. The SPM doesn't require foreign companies to select Indian partners

    My guess is, the article is mixing up the P75I submarine tender, which is under the SPM, with the procurement of torpedos for the Scorpene subs.
     

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