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Indian Nuclear Attack Submarines (SSN) - Updates & Discussions

Discussion in 'Indian Navy' started by ManuSankar, Jun 7, 2012.

  1. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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    Some background to the information posted by me before (from Prasun K. Sengupta): The following is from an earlier conversation from March 2016 -

    And then in June 2017, the Indian Govt. signed a $7.8 billion deal with Russia for the 5th & 6th reactors of the KNPP nuclear power project. If we believe the payments for the SSN design were contained within this amount, then it can be assumed that the design is already in our hands and the various companies involved are gearing up to build & launch the first of 6 boats within the next ~8 years.

    [​IMG]
    Project-705 Lira (Alfa-class)....according to PKSG, the 4++ Gen SSN design could externally resemble this, but will be some two generations ahead as far as technology and reactor-design go.

    @Agent_47 @Abingdonboy @randomradio @vstol jockey @Hjörþrimul @Ankit Kumar 001

    I am the farthest from a submarine expert so you're all welcome to pick apart these statements as you wish.
     
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  2. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Impossible to believe anything anybody says about the SSBN and SSN programs.
     
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  3. Ankit Kumar 001

    Ankit Kumar 001 Major Technical Analyst

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    As @randomradio said, do not believe anything said or written about SSN and SSBN programs.

    Even the engineers working/repairing vessels [sometimes ] nearby the SBC , didn't knew what was happening there.

    And for our SSN program..... as I said no one can say anything.

    But for our SSN Fleet, more 971M vessels are coming anyway...
     
  4. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Too good to be true. :angry:

    Electric propulsion and advanced reactor from the start itself !? Whats left, spherical sonar?


    45mW is good enough? @kaku


    JSC Amur Shipyard Shuts Down Nuclear Submarine Building Activities (Russia)




    JSC Amur Shipyard (Komsomolsk-on-Amur, Far East) will shut down nuclear submarine building activities after leasing out SSN Nerpa to Indian Navy, reported Interfax referring to Roman Trotsenko, president of JSC United Shipbuilding Corporation (USC).

    According to him, abandonment of submarine building at Amur Shipyard is related to shallow waters of Amur River which is used by submarines to reach the sea for trials. In prospect, the yard will mostly build civil ships and Project 20380/20385 corvettes for Russian Navy.

    Established in 1936, Amur Shipyard was primarily specialized in construction of submarines and civil vessels. According to the shipyard’s statistics, it has built 56 nuclear-powered submarines, 41 diesel submarines, and 137 civil ships of different classes and purposes. Through its history, the yard has built only 36 surface warships. Among submarines launched by Amur Shipyard were Project 877 Paltus diesel subs, Project 671RTM Schuka and Project 971 Schuka-B nuclear-powered submarines.

    The latest sub built by Amur Shipyard is K-152 Nerpa which will be leased to India early in 2012. The submarine was built under Project 971I Schuka-B. Presently, SSN Nerpa passes joint Russian-Indian trials. Nerpa is the third-generation submarine. Her underwater displacement is 12,800 tons. K-152 has max speed up to 30 knots and dives down to 600 meters. Nerpa is armed with four 533-mm and four 650-mm torpedo tubes.
     
  5. GuardianRED

    GuardianRED Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    This Info is 2011.... maybe things have changed? (yes stupid Q as the reason to stop building is nature itself .. but still?)
     
  6. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog Staff Member MODERATOR

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    http://nationalinterest.org/blog/th...arine-projects-feature-some-very-exotic-15618

    Only new design we know russians are working on is husky. But check out the bold part.:cheesy:

    @Gessler @kaku @Hjörþrimul @Ankit Kumar 001 @Abingdonboy
     
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  7. HELLBENT

    HELLBENT FULL MEMBER

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    lets say hypothetically somebody claims components/sections of a SSN hull are already under construction by L&T

    will it be believable ?
     
  8. Abingdonboy

    Abingdonboy Major Technical Analyst

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    Of course it is, in fact I would find it surprising if this wasn't true.
     
  9. Angel Eyes

    Angel Eyes 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    So when can we expect first sub of this class...
     
  10. Hjörþrimul

    Hjörþrimul FULL MEMBER

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    Hypothetically who's making the claim?

    That it'd be happening is probably a fine belief to have, but is it believable that someone says so? That's the crux of the argument. If I told you that India was in the process of constructing new submarines would you believe me? You might say I'm not wrong, but I can still be right and have no relevant insight into the process, just making a generalist statement and having it be true. Who's making the claim is important to watch.

    I'd actually mentioned that in a post I deleted on the previous page - I know @Hellfire will love me even more for deleting another informative post:D. Husky, should it pan out and that's far from likely - designed to be less costly then the Yasen, which are twice the cost of the Borei SSBNs, but it's anyone's guess what their status will be in a few years - will have two versions, possibly a third as well, a light SSBN.

    But yeah, Husky is currently to have two types. One a general hunter-killer with VLS capabilities, but more limited versus the SSGN variant of the Husky, which is to replace the Oscar II class submarines. Given the mammoth firepower of the Oscar II, the SSGN variant of the Husky would need greater levels of firepower then comparable SSNs like the Virginia and Improved LA classes, both of which have vertical launch systems and torpedo-tube launched cruise missiles.

    [​IMG]

    Perhaps the Husky SSGN would be closer to upcoming Virginia blocks which will add additional Virginia Payload Modules? Perhaps it'd even have greater firepower. Actually, knowing the Russians I'd say that's likely.

    [​IMG]

    Existing Virginia class submarines have just the two bow VPMs.

    [​IMG]

    Not sure what you want me to add. Russia builds good subs, so if Husky turns up as planned, it'll be quite a beast. Still nothing of note from me on a Beluga from Rubin though. Sorry.

    Side note: something India needs to invest more in is special missions submarines. Underwater sensors and cables are vulnerable to intervention by a foreign power. China and Russia, alongside the US are known to have a variety of special missiles submarines for manipulating underwater cables to gather critical, often unfiltered intelligence, or to bug SOSUS-type systems and gleen intelligence being gathered by them.

    Something like the Russian X-ray class.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Uniform class - check the starboard thruster on this beast. You can see a universal joint that allows it to pivot downwards so the submarine can maintain a "hover" while it manipulates underwater objects or helps provide illumination to divers. Uniform, built of Titanium, was capable of diving depths in excess of 1000 meters. Costly, but offering greater level of performance then naval steel. Like DSRVs, special missions submarines like Uniform tend to have spherical compartments within, also to help mitigate pressure and improve deep diving performance. Uniform's internal structure is more of an elongated orb then spherical (check Losharik below)

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Or more recently Losharik.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    This is a sketch of the 6th orb of Losharik, likely where the reactor is placed.

    [​IMG]

    I know India's current submarine fleet is underdeveloped and there are more pressing concerns - filling out SSK, SSN and SSBN fleets and supporting them with DSRVs - but this isn't an area that's kind to those that neglect it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2017
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  11. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Not many people know it, but when submarines snoop around submarine cables, there is a pretty good chance they are snooping around Indian owned cables. :D

    https://www.tatacommunications.com/...les-a-deep-dive-into-underwater-connectivity/
    Tata Communications operates the world’s largest wholly owned submarine fibre network – more than 500,000 kilometres of subsea fibre, routing 24% of all internet traffic.

    DSRVs are high on the priority list of the navy.
     
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  12. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    All we know is the project has been sanctioned as of 2015. It's in the design stage and they want to get the first sub within 15 years. Everything else is a mystery.

    Let's hope for a 2025 launch.
     
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  13. surya kiran

    surya kiran 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Impossible. The Alfa class was a sprinter with a very different type of reactor with extremely difficult maintenance and servicing techniques. Post this class, there were no other designs from the Russians, which followed up on the reactor type of this sub. Improvements learnt in this was used in the Akula class.

    The entire strategy round the Alfa was a highly maneuverable, super speed sub, with very limited scope of operations.And this was a freakingly expensive sub to manage and build. Due to its extreme operational conditions, it had a lot of titanium in its hull structure. We are quite some way away from using titanium in our subs.

    Indian SSNs need to be on long range patrols or with CBGs. The Alfa class simply does not fit the requirements.

    I am sure @vstol jockey and our very own inhouse valkyrie @Hjörþrimul will have a better understanding of this.
     
  14. kaku

    kaku Major Technical Analyst

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  15. kaku

    kaku Major Technical Analyst

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    Why deleting an open source info? Rest assured we all read this info ages ago.
     
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