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Indian Small Arms Thread

Discussion in 'Tactical Hardware' started by Gessler, May 20, 2017.

  1. Abingdonboy

    Abingdonboy Major Technical Analyst

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    @Gessler reading through the RFI for the 5.56 CQBR, I'd say it is almost tailor made for an Israeli product- the biggest giveaway is the integrated sight+IR/visible laser, only really Israelis have these solutions (Mepro MOR and MARS) and I would assume this RFI has been drafted given India's extensive experience with these weapons and sights now.
     
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  2. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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    But aren't those systems easily compatible with any rifle that has P-rails?
     
  3. Abingdonboy

    Abingdonboy Major Technical Analyst

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    Of course but the IA wants to procure them along with the weapons so it gives an advantadge to the Israelis IMHO.
     
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  4. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog Staff Member MODERATOR

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  5. GuardianRED

    GuardianRED Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    DHap8N0VoAAuUZm.jpg

    Nitpicking - wish these guys be serious in fitting their helmets properly
     
  6. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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    This post belongs in FINSAS thread :angel:

    Need helmet covers though...you know which regiment these guys are from? Sikkim Scouts?
     
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  7. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog Staff Member MODERATOR

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  8. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Defence ministry junks machine guns order for foot soldiers


    NEW DELHI: In yet another major blow to the Army's modernisation plans, the procurement plan for over 44,000 light machine guns (LMGs) for its humble foot soldiers in the infantry has been scrapped by the defence ministry.

    This is the third such project, after the cases for new assault rifles and close-quarter battle carbines, to be junked over the last two years. This once again shows that often in race to acquire big weapon systems like tanks and howitzers, desperate need to equip soldiers with basic infantry weapons, bullet-proof jackets, webbing and ballistic helmets often fall by the wayside.

    Sources said the defence ministry had "retracted" the tender or RFP (request for proposal) for the 7.62mm calibre LMGs on the ground that it had become a "single-vendor situation" with only the Israeli Weapon Industries (IWI) left in the fray after protracted field trials from December 2015 to February 2017.

    The mega "Buy and Make" procurement plan involved an initial direct purchase of around 4,400 LMGs from a foreign armament company, followed by a tie-up with the Ordnance factory Board with transfer of technology for large-scale indigenous production. The entire project would have cost an estimated Rs 13,000 crore.

    The dumping of the project comes after MoD late last year also scrapped tender issued in 2010 for 44,618 close-quarter battle carbines, in which too IWI had emerged as "resultant single-vendor" over Italian firm Beretta, amid allegations of irregularities and political intrigue.

    Last September, the Army was also forced to re-launch its global hunt for around two lakh new-generation 7.62mm x 51mm assault rifles after similar bids over last decade were scrapped due to corruption scandals, unrealistic technical requirements and change in calibre of the desired guns, as was first reported by TOI.


    The last RFP for the assault rifles was scrapped in May 2015 because of the Army's overambitious experiment to induct rifles with interchangeable barrels, with a 5.56x45mm primary barrel for conventional warfare and a 7.62x39mm secondary one for counter-terrorism. "The three cases spell big trouble for the Infantry, which has been grappling with outdated basic weapons and lack of proper bullet-proof jackets for long. Given the long-winded defence procurement procedure, it will years for the new guns to be inducted," said a source.
    http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...phoneapp&utm_medium=Twitter&utm_campaign=show



     
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  9. Hellfire

    Hellfire Devil's Advocate Staff Member MODERATOR

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    What! No one has blamed the GSQR as being changed here? :D

    Similar story to the change of personal weapon where the change in GSQR was being cited as the reason for scrapping when infantry wanted a weapon with inter-changeable barrel
     
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  10. Hellfire

    Hellfire Devil's Advocate Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Helmets come in three sizes and are issued according to fit. But some people are just unable to fathom how to wear things correctly.

    [​IMG]

    See the chin strap being below the mandible (jaw bone).


    [​IMG]

    Correct way of strapping up.

    Everyone knows it. But ... ......


    In the incorrect way, the gentleman has ensured that his ignorance will result in a broken neck if a projectile (bullet) was to hit his bullet proof patka from a very short range. The sheer momentum will cause a strong force causing an equivalent force as in hanging, breaking his cervical spine.
     
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  11. Blackjay

    Blackjay Developers Guild Developers -IT and R&D

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    I am not certain.But IIRC their were photos of Indo-China joint military exercise late last year.And our troops had same helmets.According to schedule Mku helmets were to be delivered lot later.I remember this because at that time a thought occurred to me that our soldiers sent to joint military exercises have better equipment than others back home.So maybe the Indian units close to China got these helmets long before everyone else.Even before mku deal was signed.

    Anyway according to deal first lot of mku helmets were supposed to start arriving from August,so could be those too.:biggthumpup:
     
  12. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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    So did OFB develop the 7.62 LMG (modernized FN MAG) in response to this RFP? And I suppose the IWI offer was the Negev NG7....tender retracted due to single-vendor situation means OFB product was already rejected?

    This procurement policy (and single-vendor clause) is the SHIT. This will cost us very dearly in the coming years. This policy needs to be junked.

    This policy was created with the purpose of curbing corruption (to discourage one company from playing dirty to get everyone else disqualified/paying them off to withdraw tender applications)...but it has the unfortunate side-effect of curbing national security! Possibly, an idiot who is shit-scared of being called corrupt came up with the policy...and now we have a procurement system where people are ready to sacrifice national security to save their own reputation/political prospects.

    Looking at shit like this...I feel like even Bofors scandel was worthwhile. Ofcourse there was corruption...but ATLEAST ARMY GOT SOME GUNS!!

    If this aversion mentality continues and Army has to pay the price in the battlefield, who will be held responsible? DAMN it's impossible to procure equipment for the military in this country!

    @Abingdonboy @randomradio @PARIKRAMA @Levina @Hellfire @MilSpec
     
  13. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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    Yes that was the Maratha Light Infantry. I'm not sure where their helmets were from (possibly MKU, a separate early order), but they had helmet-covers too, in camouflage.
     
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  14. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Lot of people forget that the MoD has nothing to do with a tender turning out to be a single vendor situation, only the forces are responsible until that point. MoD's job is financial only. Their job is to only negotiate for L1 and the contract.

    Same as the Berreta for the carbine tender, I bet the army would have made up some other dumb excuse to reject most of the other perfectly good rifles.

    @Hellfire You tell us?
    The army is reducing the tenders into single vendor situations. Not the MoD.

    In both cases, the Israelis won. Clearly someone higher up doesn't like the Israelis. :D
     
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  15. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    They must have moved the helmet around for comfort. I do that with motorcycle helmets.
     
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