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LCA MK2 VS Saab Gripen-An analysis in Indian context

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by HariPrasad, Dec 30, 2016.

  1. surya kiran

    surya kiran 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    What is your opinion of Bharat Forge and L&T? Are you aware that ISRO sources its components from the private sector in India? Are you aware of what the SED of Tata Power does? Where do you think missile components are made for the strategic arms programs?
     
    Shekhar Singh likes this.
  2. Vijyes

    Vijyes BANNED BANNED

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    The components of missiles are not that high tech as you want them to be. The real high technology components are electronics, rocket engine, heavy tank engines,guidance system and working parts. The parts like explosive, propellant chemicals, steel frames etc are relatively simple.
     
  3. WhyCry

    WhyCry Reaper Love Developers -IT and R&D

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    You mean that car which doesn't run yet (into production). What a dickie move.
     
  4. WhyCry

    WhyCry Reaper Love Developers -IT and R&D

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    Let's go for 50 fighters for target practise. 50 backup target practise. 300 platforms to simulate china warfare for J10 series in whole and some (for real simulation). Still 800+ excuses left.
     
  5. Vijyes

    Vijyes BANNED BANNED

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    There is already 1 squadron of Tejas in IAF. If you have nothing meaningful to say, don't say anything
     
  6. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

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    You don't design air intakes for an engine, but for a specific airflow. Tte intakes were designed for around 81kN and not for 90+ that MK2 was aimed on, so re-designing them, including the other changes is an issue, that's why MK2 got delayed.
     
  7. vstol jockey

    vstol jockey Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    You need to know few very basic things about designing aircraft. LCA is a RSS design which is inherently unstable and needs control inputs to stay stable during flight. Being a RSS design, the stability margins play a huge role in its performance and any design change or weapon integration which goes outside the limits of this CG margins will require re-calibration of FBW system requiring re-writing of codes and followed up by testing. Re-designing intakes does not change CG location as such.
     
  8. The enlightened

    The enlightened Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Noice. I wonder why GE didn't update its catalog.
    LOL if you think they will.
    The earliest AMCA dates used to be 2015. Your own link states 2020 as the previous due date for TD-1. DRDO cannot even predict what will happen 6 months from now. They've been claiming LCA will get FOC by the end of the year, since 2014 lol

    And suddenly you find them credible just in time for your argument.:rolleyes2:
    You forgot to add -'and a miracle happens here'.

    So chief engineer Sancho will 'simply' swap out the fuselage of the old Tejas and fit in a new one to make it Mk-2. No technical hurdles. No accounting for the delays faced by IAF as it's new fleet is put for rebuilding.

    Random Radio will be proud.

    Which is bollocks as license production is not going to provide our industries anywhere near the level of domestication as our own thing. Most of the sub-suppliers will remain in the country of origin and HAL/SP will assemble components using kits provided by the seller. All Tier-2 \3 suppliers shut shop, period.

    IAF is dangerously short of fighter numbers and with pending retirements of MiG fleet as well as upcoming retirements of JAG, MIRAGE will remain so for a loong time. Even 42 is just a minimum figure that doesn't take into account Chinese build up.

    You have so far made zero points. Reality doesn't agree with you either as Mk-2 development continues unabated. Just as well.
     
  9. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

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    Not really, because inviting them, doesn't mean that they are part of the development as you said in your last post, when you tried to draw a line to the F16.
    Also they were only invited to a demonstration:
    https://www.defensenews.com/air/201...-jet-and-at-6-for-light-attack-aircraft-demo/

    Lol now you are comparing the F16 with the Scorpion, just to deny that there is no need for light class multi role fighters in major air forces?
    The Scorpion is limited to light attack only and is just a niche aircraft. The USA had invited it for the advanced trainer replacement too, but they backed out, because it had to make too many changes to increase the performance, to be an advanced trainer and you are comparing it to LCA?
    According to your logic, we don't need LCA, but armed Hawks or HTT40, which however doesn't work in our threat environment, because we don't fight IS or Taliban.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2017
  10. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

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    :mrgreen: Hehe, faced with the reality and by the lack of arguments, you have to move to sarcasm now. The "old" Tejas point is funny too, given the fact that even the first MK1s will hardly be 10 years old by then.
    But the technical hurdles as said will be in designing and changing the internals of the fuselage, not in fitting them to the parts that doesn't change.

    Which you were not talking about! You said that stopping the production for new fighters, will stop the work for the Indian suppliers, which is evidently not the case because "Make in India", doesn't have to be "Made in India" according to the government. That's why foreign engines or radars for LCA, build under licence production, is work for our industry! Just as licence production of FGFA and SE radar and engines, is twice the work for our industry!!
    Also when you want to improve domestication, new LCAs doesn't make sense either, because the bulk of foreign parts will be in the 123 MK1 and 1As. So upgrading them by implementing more indigenous systems, increases the Indian content, just as we see with the coming MKI upgrade.
     
  11. surya kiran

    surya kiran 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    I am showcasing to you, that, there exists a role for light fighter aircraft. If you had read the full article, you would realise it is being envisaged to take over domestic air interdiction roles from other planes. Not by me, but the USAF Air chief and their Air Command head.

    However, Air Force officials — including Air Force Chief of Staff Gen. David Goldfein and Air Combat Command head Gen. Mike Holmes — have postulated that a buy of light aircraft could help mitigate certain readiness and training concerns. The service’s current inventory of aircraft is already overtaxed with worldwide operational missions, leaving few resources for high-end training. If it decides to purchase a small fleet of inexpensive, production-ready light aircraft, low-end missions could be offloaded to those planes, leaving its more sophisticated aircraft free for training and operations where specialized capability is needed.


    I guess, you will agree once the order is placed. Till then, well western airforces know best, I guess? You yourself are stating that it was rejected for trainer purposes, but now is being seen as a light fighter. What does that tell you? I am telling you the exact same thing. You do not need a medium role fighter for doing a light fighter's job. Is that now what they are saying too?

    Your entire assumptions and reasonings are based on an assumption that air tactics are unidimensional in nature. They are not. Every air force has its strategy in place. We do not need strategic bombers, because they are not part of our doctrine. We need light aircraft for air interdiction and additionally perform the role of CAS. Cheap to operate.

    Do not make ludicrous comments. The LCA has better performance characteristics than both the planes you sighted. Btw, the F-16 when it started off is exactly where the LCA was. It was fine tuned over a period of 40 years.
     
  12. surya kiran

    surya kiran 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    what?
     
  13. surya kiran

    surya kiran 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Cool.
     
  14. WhyCry

    WhyCry Reaper Love Developers -IT and R&D

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    Existing F16 inventory of USAF.
     
  15. surya kiran

    surya kiran 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    bus usi ki kami thi. normal plane toh nahin aa raha. ab remote wala chahiye.
     
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