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Massive anti-militancy operation launched in Kashmir’s Shopian district

Discussion in 'Internal Affairs' started by Agent_47, May 4, 2017.

  1. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-Wahabism-Sufism-and-Salafism

    Read the post by Sofi Ahmed, the first post.

    And then read the post by "Ahmed, Follower of Islamic Faith".

    You will get to know the difference in ideology right there.
     
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  2. A_poster

    A_poster Captain FULL MEMBER

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    There is no difference between Sufis and non-Sufis, theologically and philosophically. Modern liberal media is Islamist, so they try to manufacture fictional differences. Most people ,including those on this forum, does not even know what Sufism is, and most are shocked to know that Sikandar Butshikhan, Aurangzeb (and every Indian Muslim king),Deobandis, Taliban, TTP, LeT,LeJ, Sipeh Sahiba; all of them are Sufis.

    There was a very well referenced article about Sufis in Swarajmag.com on this article. https://swarajyamag.com/culture/gri...-used-to-sanitise-history-of-shahbaz-qalandar


    @randomradio Better is expected from you. :no::no::no::no::no::no:

    Sofi Ahmed, Digital Transformation Expert,Product Launch & Growth Strategist,Social Media Savvy Geek, here is just trying to shift blame of barbarism from Islam to Wahabis, while painting her group as peaceful. In truth, Sufism doe not have any ideology.Saying Sufism is an ideology is like saying smoking cigarette is an ideology.

    I have referenced all my statements with links in my previous post. I am linked Swarajmag.com article in this post, which again is well referenced.

    You simply do not want to believe evidences because they are going against what you believe to be true.
     
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  3. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    I've always held the belief that you cannot allow Muslims to come to power within non-Muslim majority countries. Islam is definitely not a secular religion.

    Let me describe it this way.

    If you put Salafis into a majority Sufi population, the Salafis will quietly try to convert the Sufis into Salafis.

    But when you put both groups into a majority non-Muslim population, with Sufis outnumbering Salafis, then the Salafis are going to practice Taqiyya, then the Salafis will quietly try to convert the Hindus and Sufis into Salafis.

    However at the same time, the Sufis will not really try and attempt to convert the Hindus and Salafis into Sufis. You send a Sufi Muslim into ISIS territory, the guy is not going to survive unless he converts.

    Deobandis are not Sufi.
    http://www.dailyo.in/politics/musli...habi-shia-sunni-deoband-rss/story/1/9961.html
     
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  4. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    That's completely wrong.

    Sufi practices are extremely bad as far as the opinion of other sects are concerned. It's because Sufis believe in Saints, celebrating their birthdays, singing, dancing, poetry etc. When have you ever seen Taliban supporting singing and dancing? Haven't you heard of ghazals?

    Even in Pakistan there was a bomb attack against Sufi Islam, the bomb exploded near a Dargah, which is considered haram by Salafists.
    http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/...baz-qalandar-sufi-shrine-170216144747128.html

    Dargahs are specific only to Sufis.

    As of today, there is no religion specific Sufi terrorist organization in the world today, minus some rebels. Basically, all Islamic terrorist groups operating against India right now are non-Sufi.

    ISIS, Al Qaeda, LeT, HuM, Taliban etc are all Salafi or similar.

    Here's a bit about Modi's speech at the World Sufi Forum.
    http://www.livemint.com/Politics/TH...rror-groups-are-instruments-of-state-pol.html
     
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  5. lca-fan

    lca-fan Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    UN chief following Indo-Pak rift closely, says spokesperson
    [​IMG]
    May 05, 2017 | 13:19 IST | SOURCE : Times Now, Agencies

    • United Nations: After the conclusion of the third review meet of the United Nations Human Right Council (UNHRC), it has been learnt that the UN Secretary-General Antonion Guterres is following the Indo-Pak rift “closely” and again asked the two neighboring nations to end the disputes through peaceful engagement and dialogue.

      His spokesperson Stephane Dujarric made the announcement at the daily press briefing yesterday in view of the recent tension between India and Pakistan, and the media speculation that a nuclear war may break out between them.

      "We're obviously following the situation closely, the recent developments included, and I think we would reiterate our call for the parties to find a peaceful solution through engagement and dialogue," Dujarric said.

      India-Pakistan tension has escalated after two Indian soldiers were killed and their bodies mutilated in Kashmir by the Pakistani military this week.

      Report: Mutilation of soldiers a dastardly and inhuman act, Indian DGMO tells Pak counterpart

      The Indian Army warned of "appropriate response" for the "despicable act."

      Defence minister Arun Jaitley said in Delhi that the "sacrifice (of the two killed) will not go in vain" and theIndian armed forces will react "appropriately" to the "inhuman act" of the Pakistani troops.

      "This is a reprehensible and an inhuman act. Such attacks do not take place during war," he said.

      The Indian Army issued a statement saying that the bodies of one of its soldiers and a BSF head constable were mutilated.
    • http://www.timesnow.tv/internationa...indo-pak-rift-closely-says-spokesperson/60502
     

    Attached Files:

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  6. Hellfire

    Hellfire Devil's Advocate Staff Member MODERATOR

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    The 'Islamisation' of Kashmir was 'fuelled' to make it a pure Deobandi vs Wahabi vs Sufis.

    What one has to realise is that as in any classical insurgency where generally you have three groups of people - those who support insurgency, those who oppose it forming a small minority and the large neutral majority, in J&K too there were broadly four groups of people at the start of the insurgent movement.


    1. A quite a large group of Kashmiris who were wanting to be with India.
    2. A significant but small group which wanted complete independence.
    3. A microscopic group which wanted to join Pakistan.
    4. An overwhelming majority which had no views.

    What has happened in 90s was that the no 3 group, which gained ascendancy by combining with no 2 group on the common ground of evicting India, was defeated by the active working of the no 1 group above in conjunction with Security Forces. By 1996, the gain was complete, whereupon, Gujral, unilaterally, pulled out armed forces to a certain extent in valley and allowed things to go awry.

    From 2007, and I am giving you a very definite year as this was the year when militancy was, for all practical purposes, over in Kashmir, the groups got redefined into the undermentioned group:


    1. A quite a large group of Kashmiris wanting to remain with India.
    2. A significantly very large group which wants complete freedom from India.
    3. A significantly larger group wanting to join Pakistan than previous but fraction of no 1 and 2.
    4. A microscopic group which wants to join the 'caliphate' (oh they are there, the delusive ones)
    5. A significantly smaller group, yet pre-dominant (more than 50%-60%) of neutral Kashmiris.

    It is the no 5 group in above and no 4 in the above, which are the deciding factors.

    Where the game is being played:

    a. Political Level: At this level, one has to understand who benefits the most from a continued unrest in Kashmir. In spite and despite of Article 370 and the provisions wherein State can cede powers to centre thereby rendering it a useless relic, there has never been a move to cede powers to the Centre by the State Government. (here the experts on constitutional aspects can chip in)

    Also, the State government has been led by mainly two families. The Abdullahs and the Muftis. What makes the whole systems a dubious one is the fact that we have an excellent intelligence grid in Kashmir by and large. Burhan Wani was being kept under surveillance directly and indirectly. Yet, the timing of his killing and the fact that the body was released to the family, raises red flags.

    What was the motive behind it? This query I had posted in the other forum too at the time of occurrence of the incident. Indian Army could have killed him earlier too, yet he was not removed. Then the government released his body and a funeral procession was organised where thousands attended his funeral, his 'virtues' were extolled by separatists, and paid agents as well as militants bearing weapons and the whole process was allowed to continue inspite of intelligence sleuths being embedded and Army units just some distance off. Why?

    It is that incident and the present day's cycle of violence which needs to be checked. What tangible gains for India? Nil.

    b. Economic Level: The economy of Kashmir is based on tourism. With spiralling of violence, it is severely affected. Who gains? Not the local population.

    An increased level of violence leads to increased presence of extra security forces in terms of CAPFs and IA units. Where is the economic factor here?

    It comes in the requirement of logistics support. There are contractors in Valley whose sole job is to provide services to SFs. Majority are working for the Political Class and the Separatists. Increased SFs convert into increased 'business' being created. In 2011, in a raid conducted in Bandipore, a porn industry was unearthed. The 'manager' of the facility was arrested by army unit there and handed over to police, in less than 24 hours, he was released as Hurriyat gave a call to Government and he was released.

    Increased incidences allows Government to ask for additional funds for 'perception management'. What is perception management for General population of a state? The provisioning of visible elements of governance like infrastructure, health care, educational institutes and vocational/higher degree education. Yet, if one travel in Kashmir, outside of Srinagar, the roads are horrible. And in peripheral villages along LC, there is no road, no availability of assured healthcare services etc. In short, a basket case of state with pathetic governance as hallmark.

    In this vacuum, groups like Jamaat-e-Islami and Ahl E Hadith are mushrooming, filling this vacuum and in the process, increasing their reach and their ability to 'guide' the perception of the people.

    Funding is sent from Saudi Arabia, UAE and generally all the nations which constitute GCC and Sunni Dominated nations.

    These are only two aspects which one needs to look at through a fine lens. Pakistan's role is very less frankly speaking.

    If Indian Government works to rectify these two main points, it can work effectively to check Pakistan once for all.


    Of course it is paid. You have daily wage earners forming the bulk of a population working. When strikes last months on an end, how does a man or a woman support his/her family? Where is the money?

    A deliberate strategy of politicians-separatists nexus.


    Nothing new you have posted here. This is simply an intellectualisation. And merging of different philosophies into one.

    The core concepts of insurgency are not based on religious lines.

    The only difference is you have tried to push forward another narrative for reasons best known to you. Not only Sufis, but also Kashmiri Pandits had animosity towards India. It is a recorded fact.

    If you are going to tag me in a post, put up a better post. Unlike your perception, I am not swayed by extremist or non extremist.

    Read back to posts I have made on Jamaat.

    Read the history of Jamaat. You will be able to join the dots.

    You will come across takfiris too. That is the more rabid form of Islamists.

    When you use Salafist-wahabi-takfiri, the ideology remains same, but the following with interpretation changes with the latter considering even Muslims who do not confirm to their view point as kafir.

    What you are trying to do, is push a narrative of Islam in context of Kashmir, a mistake!

    Neither have a correlation. They will have correlation in next 3-5 years, as a result of policies of GoI.

    You are so wrong.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2017
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  7. Indian Jatt

    Indian Jatt Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    I feel like a big war is upon us.....maybe a war as big as ww2?....i dont know, i am getting worried about our men and women in uniform, may god help them achieve peace through violence......
     
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  8. lca-fan

    lca-fan Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    Did India Carried Out Surgical Strikes Again from Afghan Border?

    Locals from Pakistan on Af-Pak Borders are silently murmuring and cursing Indian Commandos who carried out a raid and buthchered PA men dressed in khakees. As many as 45 PA men killed yesterday with their APC's either destroyed or or captured Pak Air force too has carried out a bombing mission effects of which has not been reported as of now.

    Modi and his Afghan President Ashraf Ghani had some Kuchi-Ku yesterday afternoon post GSLV launch carrying SAARC SAT.



    It was a surprise attack .......:woot::woot::woot:

    In short Surgical Strike 2:yahoo::yahoo::yahoo::yahoo::yahoo:
     
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  9. NKVD

    NKVD 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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  10. Abingdonboy

    Abingdonboy Major Technical Analyst

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    @Hellfire can you explain it to me simply how these scum are able to move around the state (along with their arms) seeminly with impunity and attack the security forces at will? We all know how heavily security forces are deployed in J&K, how is it possible that terrorists can have such an easy time moving around and never seem to be intercepted? It's not like the state is all that large or there are any parts that there isn't a presence of security forces. One can understand how the Taliban menace continues in Afghanistan where the govt's will barely extends outside of Kabul but how is it possible a few hundred rats are able to pin down one of the world's most capable armies and hit at it again and again?
     
  11. Golden_Rule

    Golden_Rule Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Whatever the form of Islam - Sufi, Salafi, Wahabi, Takfiri, etc, the primary guiding force is "hatred" towards other religions, in the absence of it, this same "hatred" is used against each other as is happening in Iraq, Syriya, and the rest of the Islamic states in order to establish the supremacy of these offshoots.

    Back to the primary motivation of "hatred", the next step of these "-ist's" is to execute "hatred". This is done by projecting the GOI and State Govt as "monsters" who are obstructing the fulfillment of their motivations; thus creating a target enemy in the first place. Once the illusion of the "target" is credibly established in the local population, in order to execute their passion of hatred, financing of leaders who pay the hired daily wages foot soldiers, aka stone pelters and local terrorists is made possible. Before the surgical strike of demonetization, it was thru hawala and fake currency, and now newer ways are invented, and the Times now exposure is one of them.

    The bank robberies and the cash vans looting are the most desperate attempt of the local terrorists, which they have been avoiding till now, lest it makes them vilians of the local economy in the eyes of the local population.
     
  12. Butter Chicken

    Butter Chicken Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    1 JKP,1 Jihadi,2 Civilians killed yesterday in encounter
     
  13. Butter Chicken

    Butter Chicken Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    [​IMG]


    Islamic terrorists of the Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front (JKLF) parade 08 August 1991 at heart of Srinagar.
     
  14. Butter Chicken

    Butter Chicken Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Militiants shout "Allahu Akbar" and "Nara-e-Takbeer" while firing gun after jihadi killed yesterday.Misguided youth?

     
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  15. Veeran

    Veeran 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    It is quite sad that there still people who think Congress did great. I talked to someone last day and he was a fool who thought UPA-1 was a game changer govt. I didn't ask what he thought of UPA-II.
     
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