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No more ambiguity around Vikramaditya

Discussion in 'Indian Navy' started by Hembo, Jun 8, 2011.

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  1. Hembo

    Hembo OLD MOD STAR MEMBER

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    No more ambiguity around Vikramaditya | Russia & India Report

    India and Russia have resolved all questions regarding the upgrading of the aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov, Security Council Secretary Nikolai Patrushev said after talks with his Indian colleague, the Indian prime minister’s National Security Adviser Shiv Shankar Menon on Monday, June 6.

    “During the talks we discussed military-technical cooperation in detail and went over the [upgrading of] the Admiral Gorshkov and the schedule [of works]. We have no questions, and nor does the Indian side,” Patrushev said.

    He noted that “no unsolvable questions arose” during the discussion of military-technical cooperation. “There are questions that need to be discussed and that need support,” he added. Patrushev admitted, “Acute questions did arise in the past and required the leaders of the two countries to interfere… now everything is solved in the routine way.”

    An additional contract for repair and upgrading of the heavy aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov was signed in March 2010 during Prime Minister Vladimir Putin's visit to India.

    The document allows the two countries to reach mutually acceptable agreements on this issue.

    A year before that, Indian Defence Minister Pallam Raju said his country had agreed to negotiate for a revised sum of the contract. Under a packet inter-governmental agreement signed in New Delhi in January 2004, the body of the Admiral Gorshkov was transferred to India for free subject to its upgrading at Sevmash and armament with Russian aircraft. Russia will also train the Indian crew of about 1,500 and create an infrastructure for the ship in the Indian Ocean.

    The overall cost of the contract was estimated at 1.5 billion U.S. dollars, of which about 974 million U.S. dollars were intended for the conversion of the ship into a full-scale aircraft carrier. All work was supposed to be completed in 2008. However the completion date has been postponed. Russia claimed that the volume of work had been underestimated and demanded an additional payment of 2.2 billion U.S. dollars.

    According to the Sevmash shipyard, the Vikramaditya (Powerful) is about 50 percent completed. If financing is provided regularly, Sevmash plans to complete work and begin testing at sea in 2011. The ship has to be handed over to the Indian Navy at the end of 2012. It is designed to operate for 30 years.

    The Admiral Gorshkov was built in Nikolayev under the name of Baku and put to service in the Northern Fleet in 1987. It is 283 metres long, 51 metres wide, with water displacement of over 45,000 tonnes.

    Russian President Dmitry Medvedev called for completing the modernisation of the aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov for India's Navy. When visiting the Sevmash shipyard in July 2009, he asked its management detailed questions about the status of the project.

    The Gorshkov project has turned into the only problem in Russian-Indian relations, the president said. “We should view it as the first and very difficult experience,” he said, adding, “It should be completed and commissioned. Otherwise, this will have bad consequences,” he warned.

    Medvedev severely criticised all parties involved in the project and regretted that the Russian side had assumed certain obligations during talks with Indian colleagues. "Why did you sign up for this? As a result we all have to make excuses: you to me, and I to our Indian colleagues," the president said.

    Sevmash Director-General Nikolai Kalistratov said after the examination of the ship's mechanisms and units that its modernisation happened to be much more expensive than was initially expected. “All equipment had to be changed. And the price rose considerably,” he said.

    Kalistratov said the shipyard would complete the project by all means. “We have already made all the decisions and preparations for the testing,” he said, adding that the ship would be tested by the Russian side first and then Indian colleagues would join in.

    Transfer and acceptance tests are scheduled for 2012.

    Sevmash is the only shipyard in Russia that builds nuclear submarines for the Navy. It employs over 25,000 people. Since its creation in 1939, Sevmash has built 45 surface ships and 163 submarines, including 128 nuclear-powered ones.

    Sevmash has been reorganised into a joint stock company and will join the Northern Shipbuilding and Ship Repair Centre, one of the three holdings within the United Shipbuilding Corporation, the creation of which should be completed in 2009.
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2011
  2. Mr.Ryu

    Mr.Ryu Captain SENIOR MEMBER

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    Bring this home already :devil:
     
  3. Rajat Angurala

    Rajat Angurala FULL MEMBER

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    Indian Navy all set to welcome INS Vikramaditya

    The Indian Navy is all set to welcome the INS Vikramaditya. The navy set the ball rolling to integrate the aircraft carrier (earlier known as the Admiral Gorshkov) with its fleet as the warship, being redone at a Russian shipyard, readies to sail home in early 2013.
    The integration plan was discussed at a recent meeting of naval commanders in New Delhi as some key “firstsâ€￾ are associated with the ship. More than double the size of existing aircraft carrier INS Viraat, it will be the biggest warship ever to be operated by the Indian Navy. The second crucial aspect is that for the first time, the navy would be operating supersonic combat jets from the flight deck. Once it arrives, the naval fleet will have to be arranged around it, as the Vikramaditya would become the central platform.

    The fleet rearrangement is also necessitated by the fact that the navy is in the middle of a modernisation drive as many warships are under construction. It is estimated that by the time the Vikramaditya joins the fleet, the navy would have added the remaining two of the state-of-the-art multirole Shivalik-class stealth frigates, the first of which has already been delivered. It would also have at least two new antisubmarine warfare corvettes. The navy will also get three new potent Talwar-class frigates, being built in Russia. In fact, close to 40 new warships are under construction at various shipyards in the country. This means that the fleet will not only grow in numbers but will also have modern warships.
     
  4. smestarz

    smestarz Lt. Colonel REGISTERED

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    Finally we shall get INS Vikramaditya. hope the wait was worth it
     
  5. smestarz

    smestarz Lt. Colonel REGISTERED

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    If the navy considers deployment of Vikramaditya, then it has to have its entire entourage to go with it,
    Like companion cruisers (we dont have any) destroyers, frigates, fleet tankers, submarines for reconaissance
    Considering all these threats, is the cost of having an aircraft carrier worth it?

    I firmly believe that the age of Aircraft carrier is gone. The only reason that USA has to have aircraft carrier is to ensure global deployment of its forces, but it is a very big problem for them

    There are many Anti shipping missiles and our own Brahmos which is designed to get thru the enemy defences, and considering the range of these missiles, a pair or Group of 4 destroyers can destroy an entire fleet in matter of hours.
    Sure it is not easy as I say as Americans do have top of the line defence system. but considering that say 30-40 missiles fired at different time but reaching same time at 1 multi billion dollar asset, you feel not a single one can get through?
    The present defence doctrine is that the missiles/gun intercepts single missile, but when its big asset like an aircraft carrier, would the opposing forces fire one missile and wait? I would prefer to fire all my weapons and depart the scene and let the enemy defence now think to protect its asset.
    Who the hell fires one missile and waits for that missile to hit or miss???
    There have beeen incidents where CIWS of US navy have shot its own aircraft by mistake.. :) so when the system is overwhelmed thats where the true value and worth of system is known..
     
  6. smestarz

    smestarz Lt. Colonel REGISTERED

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    I think Aircraft carrier doctrine is good for country like USA which is basically an island with not so powerful neighbours . Canada and mexico. and also these countries are in friendly terms. So their Aircraft carrier doctrine is more for force projection and in Ocean, they are never kept close to enemy shores, If America and Canada were enemies, I do not see aircraft carrier parked off New york. Maybe more south of new york.
    Present weapons and navionics are good enough to make even a destroyer on par with an aircraft carrier in terms of ability to hit.
    A decade ago the biggest Ship after an aircraft carrier was a cruiser, and now how many countries have cruisers? Russia ? USA? China?

    A destroyer of present century has more powerful weapons and technology thati it can hit a moving target at range of 20 miles with its guns. And more than 200 miles with its missiles. So a destroyer is a mini-aircraft carrier and its hit weapons are missiles Antishipping and cruise missiles.
    Also a few UAV or UCAV can give it an "almost" aircraft carrier ability.. Anyone wants to debate?
     
  7. smestarz

    smestarz Lt. Colonel REGISTERED

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    I think Aircraft carrier doctrine is good for country like USA which is basically an island with not so powerful neighbours . Canada and mexico. and also these countries are in friendly terms. So their Aircraft carrier doctrine is more for force projection and in Ocean, they are never kept close to enemy shores, If America and Canada were enemies, I do not see aircraft carrier parked off New york. Maybe more south of new york.
    Present weapons and navionics are good enough to make even a destroyer on par with an aircraft carrier in terms of ability to hit.
    A decade ago the biggest Ship after an aircraft carrier was a cruiser, and now how many countries have cruisers? Russia ? USA? China?

    A destroyer of present century has more powerful weapons and technology that it can hit a moving target at range of 20 miles with its guns. And more than 200 miles with its missiles. So a destroyer is a mini-aircraft carrier and its hit weapons are missiles Antishipping and cruise missiles.
    Also a few UAV or UCAV can give it an "almost" aircraft carrier ability.. Anyone wants to debate?
     
  8. GUNS-N- ROSES

    GUNS-N- ROSES Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    i do agree with most of u r views.

    aircraft careers are essentially fro force projection. they might present themselves as easy targets due to big size. however following points need consideration:

    1. Aircraft carriers never move alone. thay have destroyers/frigates/corvettes along with them cas AC alone is a sitting duck. a frigate with potent ASW capability leads the battle group of which ac carrier is a part. Ac carrier
    has aircraft planes SA missile and CIWS which are more than adequate to protect ac carrier from aerial threats.

    2. i know an AC carrier in Indo pak conflict wont be of much help but if u want force projecion in south east asia sea then u need ac carriers. sooner or later india will have to stand up to china. its better if we start preparing now.
     
  9. ManuSankar

    ManuSankar Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    I cant agree with you.Normally a carrier has multiple layers of defenses against all kinds of threat, from both air and sea.And how are you planing to launch the missiles.Also there are not many missiles capable of destroying a carrier.Chinese DF-21 may be an exception.But we don't know the true capabilities of that missile.And you cant destroy a aircraft carrier using missiles like Brahmos.Even if its possible you have to get close enough to fire those things.you have to get past their escorts first.All carriers have anti submarine warships as escorts,submarines has to get close to the carrier to fire its torpedo.My point is an Aircraft carrier will be always important for war and also for projecting power
     
  10. ManuSankar

    ManuSankar Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    I cant agree with you.Normally a carrier has multiple layers of defenses against all kinds of threat, from both air and sea.And how are you planing to launch the missiles.Also there are not many missiles capable of destroying a carrier.Chinese DF-21 may be an exception.But we don't know the true capabilities of that missile.And you cant destroy a aircraft carrier using missiles like Brahmos.Even if its possible you have to get close enough to fire those things.you have to get past their escorts first.All carriers have anti submarine warships as escorts,submarines has to get close to the carrier to fire its torpedo.My point is an Aircraft carrier will be always important for war and also for projecting power
     
  11. wanids94

    wanids94 FULL MEMBER

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    how do you think those destroyers will get within 200 miles of a aircraft carrier?
     
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