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PAK-FA 5th Generation Aircraft

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by tariqkhan18, Jun 30, 2010.

  1. Sancho

    Sancho Major Technical Analyst

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    True but how far are we willing to delay the project, just to get more ToT? The longer we wait, the more stealth fighters China will pop out and the larger their edge gets.
     
  2. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog Staff Member MODERATOR

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    I don't feel we are that desperate to have a stealth fighter in our inventory. Our immediate requirements are Medium/rafales and Light/LCAs. Stealth fighter is not a wildcard. A healthy number of rafales are good enough to counter Chinese J20.
     
  3. Sancho

    Sancho Major Technical Analyst

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    You can't counter what you don't see, that's the whole point about stealth and higher numbers of Rafale won't change that. Stealth fighters should actually be out highest priority for IAF as well as for IN in a dedicated program, but since our fleet numbers are in such a mess, we still are tring to figure out to get the basic numbers of fighters some day. But if we finally have LCA and MMRCA's we might not be the technological leader in the region, especially if the UAE or other Gulf countries are pushing for stealth fighters too.
     
    Sathya likes this.
  4. layman

    layman Aurignacian STAR MEMBER

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    Guys correct me if am wrong, Stealth is not going to be much of a issue after couple of decades. With the developments going on in the radar tech, Stealth won't matter much in the future.
     
  5. stephen cohen

    stephen cohen Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    We have not yet seen or tested PAK FA

    So we cannot just believe what The Russians are just Saying

    Rafale is; as on today ; much better than J 20
     
  6. Sancho

    Sancho Major Technical Analyst

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    Why not? Detection methods might be improving, but so are stealth developments. We already see 6th gen stealth design concepts and they will further reduce the RCS. When the human factor is out of the fighter, the size of fighters will be much lower too.
    It's basically an ongoing development process since the WW2.
     
  7. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    It also could be the only thing that matters.
     
  8. Sancho

    Sancho Major Technical Analyst

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    IAF officials constantly follow Pak Fa's development and assessing it, to what they want FGFA to be.
    And no Rafale is not better than any stealth fighter, since it's half a generation behind in design, although possibly on par on techs.
     
  9. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Question: There are millions of parts to an advanced jet fighter, all have to be manufactured perfectly, and assembled perfectly for a pilot to survive. With the corruption, and work ethics and devotion of HAL employees make you willing to fly their planes? Can a country that does not even produce civilian planes of any note build safe and effective fighter aircraft.
     
  10. stephen cohen

    stephen cohen Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    IAF pilots and Engineers have Not been anywhere close to PAK FA

    All the information is through Blogs and Lengthy descriptions on some websites

    J 20 is just a stealthy " shaped " plane ie Externally speaking
    Inside it is Chinese junk Avionics

    Even Su 35 is Better than J 20

    China cannot make a radar like BARS or IRBIS ; Only Pakistanis are impressed by Chinese goods
     
  11. stephen cohen

    stephen cohen Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Yes we can Trust HAL

    Today They make Su 30 MKI and LCA

    And in the past they have made Mig 21 ; Mig 27 ; Jaguar

    They make AL 31 engines and RD 33 Series 3 engines for SU 30 and Mig 29

    Today HAL is also upgrading Mig 29 and Mirage 2000 Fleet
    which after upgradation are better than
    F 16 Block 52 that you have Given to Pakistan
     
  12. Sancho

    Sancho Major Technical Analyst

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    :rolleyes:

    http://indiandefence.com/threads/ia...light-demonstration-of-pak-fa-in-russia.6990/


    Which is enough, since that gives stealth fighters the biggest edge. They can have less capable systems or weapons, but if their stealth design works, they will have the first look advantage.
     
  13. stephen cohen

    stephen cohen Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    IAF pilots have not flown PAK FA so far

    So we know nothing about its avionics and RCS and Internal weapons Bays

    Seeing a flying Demo does nt mean anything

    There are many articles on the Internet about the so called capabilities of J 20

    I have no reason to believe you

    Even IAF chief has said that Rafale can take on anything that China throws at us

    Right now J 20 is good for Nothing ;
    It is At least Seven Years away from being fully operational

    Chinese are desperate to be recognised as a super power ; hence such tall claims

    And then they raise a ruckus when Taiwan gets AESA in their F 16
     
  14. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    These planes are assembled in India, but most part manufactured in other countries.
    Su-30 is not made in India. Some parts are made in India.

    Several parts & components are from Russia & other countries. For instance, the engines, some avionics (like IRST, Radar, etc.), parts of airframe (alloys - Titanium), etc. - they come from Russia. Some avionics like the HUD, ECMs, Targeting pods, etc. come from Israel.

    Similar case with spare parts, they are related to Russia. The exact percentage of indigenous content is not known but majority of all important components are imported and it’s difficult to say because the contract makes India purchase a lot of raw materials directly from Russia.
     
  15. The enlightened

    The enlightened 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    As the technology to detect 'stealth' fighter improves, so does the technology to detect non-stealth fighters. The aim of 'stealth' is not to avoid detection which is impossible but to reduce detectability at least in comparison to enemy fighter jets to give yourself the first look first kill advantage. Additionally not every missile and fighter jet can carry a hundred metre long low frequency radar. Photonics is yet to be applied to any operational radar. Ditto quantum radar. In short 'stealth' is an aid to increase survivability, not an on/off button by which you are either completely invisible or shot down by Sino/Ruso missile. Which is why despite claiming that they can beat Yankee stealth planes, both the Chinese and Russians are furiously expending billions of $$$ to make themselves their own stealth fighter.
     
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