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PLAAF: News & Discussions

Discussion in 'China & Asia Pacific' started by MiG-23MLD, Feb 24, 2014.

  1. RMFAN

    RMFAN Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Check out and read the following book, you can understand how the Japanese car companies start.

    Between Imitation and Innovation: The Transfer and Hybridization of Productive Models in the International Automobile Industry 198th Edition
    by Robert Boyer (Editor), Elsie Charron (Editor), Ulrich Jürgens (Editor), Steven Tolliday (Editor)
     
  2. GuardianRED

    GuardianRED Captain FULL MEMBER

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    :dude:

    ????? Why?????

    It is a know FACT that the american had taxed heavy targeting the Japanese ... so 'a go round' was to simply to set up factories and using American labour - thus building Japanese Cars made in USA . - A win win situation - Heck my 2015 Honda CRV was made in USA is STILL a Japanese Vehicle.

    Second , hybridization is a fancy word for PARTS SHARING .... in both design n built , thus bringing the overall cost down ...... duh!
    What is your point?:smoking1::coffee:
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2017
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  3. GuardianRED

    GuardianRED Captain FULL MEMBER

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    Why are you copying and pasting your answers?

    And again - This still doesn't answer to why buy the Su35?
     
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  4. RMFAN

    RMFAN Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    24 Su-35 fighters will be the last order of jet fighters from China to Russia.

    They will be the good training partners for Chinese J-16, J-15, J-10B/C and J-20, since these Chinese jets will face Su-35 fighters from India, Vietnam and the other countries sooner or later. After traning with these Su-35, Chinese homemade fighters will figure out the right tactics to beat the Su-35.

    If USA is allowed to buy Su-35 for training with their F-22 and F-35, they do not mind to buy a few with a heavy price tag. BTW, China just wants to buy a few Su-35 for reference at the beginning, but the Russian demanding the minimum quantity is 24.

     
  5. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog IDF NewBie

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    For 'training' and 'research' :biggthumpup:

    'Fake news' with Chinese characteristics :troll:
     
  6. GuardianRED

    GuardianRED Captain FULL MEMBER

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    huh???

    Why are you changing your narrative?? didn't your earlier post say that the reason the Su35 was bought was for the engines ??? and NOW it is for training??? .... why the change? pls pick a side!
     
  7. ashkum2278

    ashkum2278 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    (a) The reason the chinese went in for the Su-35 was for the engine, radar and EW suite.
    (b) The chinese are still lagging far behind in AESA technology. They are still a decade behind the US and it would take them a lot of time to develop and manufacture radars similar to APG-81. That is why they procured the SU-35 for radar and engine technology.
    (c) Who said anything about India procuring Su-35s. India will not procure SU35 when it has SU-30 MKI which is similar ot Su-35 in avaionics and EW Suite. Once the Su30's undergo Super 30 upgrade, indian su30's would be technologically much more advanced, compared to chinese SU35's.
    (d) There is no point in gong in for additional SU-30 MKI because in any case we would be procuring close to 50 jets with Super 30 configuration. This would be done to take care of OLD Su30 airframes which would not undergo the Super 30 Upgrade. These old air frames would then be used purely for training purposes only.

    Please got through the Radar eqaation in the below video to get a better understanding of stealth and how AESA Radars function. Having X number of T/R modules does not guarantee performance. There are are other much more important factors that determine the quality, range & performance of an AESA RADAR. Just saying the radar has X number of T/R modules amounts to nothing.

     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2017
  8. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

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    They surpass the Su33, because they wasn't upgraded, but neither Chinese radars or engines came close to the performance of Russian counterparts. That's why you kept importing the engines for J10 and JF17.

    Which proves what I said, China can can re-engineer older Russian engines and develop roughly similar once on your own now, but the real leap ahead still takes more time, while Russia already has superior engine classes today and is developing NG once too.



    Again, exactly my point! China has learned to move from 3rd gen manufacturing to modern 4th gen now, which is indeed a good achievement, but that only shows your industrial capabilities, not the design and innovation once. The fact that most of J20 and J31 designs is based on Russian or US original designs, once again shoes the limitation of re-engineering. You can catch up faster, but it doesn't gain you real development experience. Upgrading J10/J11 over the years, gave your industry more experience and know how, than re-engineering foreign designs and I hope India can say the same some day, with the experience gained through the LCA program.

    As I said before, I have no doubt about Chinese industrial capabilities, I only distinguish between that and the development side and the examples you mentioned, confirms that.

    India is sadly no where near the capability in most fields, but we can use our access to foreign partners to an advantage as well and doesn't need to re-engineer. Sadly we are too proud to use it smartly.


    P.S. Would be grateful if you can add some pics or info's to the exercise thread I linked you to, between PAF and PLAAF.
     
  9. RMFAN

    RMFAN Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Chinese fighter jets to control drones in battle by satellite in five years: experts
    Source
    Global Times
    Editor
    Zhang Tao
    Time
    2017-09-20
    China's fighter jets will be capable of remotely controlling drones by satellite within five years, experts said Tuesday.

    China's fifth-generation stealth fighters J-20 and J-31 will be capable of mobilizing the drones for battle by serving as their control platforms, Xu Yongling, a retired PLA chief test pilot and an expert at the Chinese Society of Aeronautics and Astronautics, said at a recent defense seminar, Cankaoxiaoxi newspaper reported.

    Xu explained to the Global Times Tuesday that "China could achieve the technology within five years. Chinese fighter jets will have the ability to control drones in real time in battles in the Indian Ocean, the west Pacific Ocean and South China Sea."

    Manned fighter jets can easily remotely control a small drone fleet with artificial intelligence (AI). But satellites are needed for fighter jets to have the flexibility of controlling drones and alter their mission in changing situations, according to Xu.

    The J-20 and J-31 could remotely control up to six large drones armed with missiles or a fleet made up of smaller drones if they are equipped with AI, Fu Qianshao, another air defense expert, said.

    It would be better for single-pilot jets to be equipped with a computerized co-pilot to process information from artificial sensors, Fu told the Global Times.

    The AI technology is much more likely to be first used in twin-pilot aircraft, like third-generation fighter jets such as the J-10 and J-16. One pilot would process the data transmitted from drones, while the other pilot focuses on the manned mission, Fu said.

    However, Xu admitted that the technology poses a problem. "It's unknown if the fighter jets can reconfigure the missions of the drones in time with keyboard commands. Current drones are all programmed, which means their missions cannot be altered in the air."

    US Air Force Chief Scientist Gregory Zacharias was quoted by US magazine the National Interest in July as saying that F-35s, F-22s and other fighter jets will use AI to control nearby drone wingmen in high risk areas as well.
     
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  10. RMFAN

    RMFAN Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    http://mil.news.sina.com.cn/china/2017-09-21/doc-ifymesii4602948.shtml

    At the 17th Beijing International Air Show opened at the Beijing National Convention Center on September 19, Beijing Tianjiao Aviation Industry Investment Co., Ltd. and its Chongqing Tianjiao Aviation Power Co., Ltd. (collectively Tianjiao Aviation) and the Ukrainian Motor Sich Company exhibited 6 aircraft engines, showing the new achievements of China-Ukraine aviation power cooperation and development planning.



    1. AI-322-25 turbofan engine, can be equipped in China's L-15 advanced trainer and the Russian Yak -130 senior trainer machine.

    2.TV3-117VMA-SBM1V series turboshaft engine, is mainly equipped with Russian Mi series and Ka series helicopters, excellent reliability in high altitude areas and other extreme conditions with adaptability to meet scientific expedition, material transport, rescue and other aspects of the urgent need.

    3. AI-450C series turboprop engine, is mainly used for light multi-purpose general purpose aircraft, trainers and unmanned aerial vehicles, the fuel consumption is lower than similar products by more than 20%, Austrian Diamond Airlines produced DA-50 and DART-450 equipped with this products.

    4.MS-14 turboprop engine with AV-17 or AV-36 propeller, can be equipped with 30 people to provide power for regional aircraft.

    5.The MS-500V Series Turboshaft Engine, was awarded the Model Certificate issued by the CIS Inter-State Airline Committee in 2014 and can be fitted with a multi-purpose helicopter with a takeoff weight of 3.5 to 6 tons.

    6. The AI-9V-1 Auxiliary Power Unit (APU) is the latest addition to the AI-9V, which offers greater power extraction capability as a ground or airborne power supply to provide compressed airflow for helicopter engine start-up systems.

    The cooperation between Motor Sich & Tianjiao seems doesn't get affected by the latest drama, new contract signed in Beijing including

    TV3-117VMA-SBM1V series turboshaft engine serial production & overhaul, TV3-117VMA-SBM1V engine purchase intention. 2/

    Supplemental agreement of MS-500V turboshaft engine joint development. Their next job will be assembling JL-10‘s AI-322-25 engine in China.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]



    TV3-117VMA-SBM1V 4E series

    This engine is intended for civil helicopters.
    Compared with helicopters powered by TV2-117 engines, TV3-117VMA-SBM1V engines can keep their power up to high environment temperatures and high altitudes of location and flight.
    2.5-minute power setting provides safe helicopter take off and landing with one engine inoperative (OEI).

    [​IMG]
    Main advantages of the engine:
    • high reliability;
    • increased power maintained in hot and high conditions;
    • low SFC;
    • long service life;
    • easy in-service maintenance;
    • high repairability;
    • stable operation under conditions of heavy smoke and dust;
    • low cost of life cycle.
    Basic specifications:
    2.5-minute power rating and
    continuous power rating - 60 min (Cont 1) OEI
    (SLS, ISA+10°C)


    Power, shp (KW) 1700 (1251)
    Continuous power rating - 60 min (Cont 2) OEI
    Continuous take-off power rating (CTO) 30-min,
    Take-off power rating (SLS, ISA)

    Power, shp (kW) 1500 (1104)
    The power can be kept up to environment temperature, °C +55
    Specific fuel consumption, kg/hp•h 0.261
    Cruise power setting (SLS, ISA):
    Power, shp (kW) 1000(736)
    The power can be kept up to environment temperature, °C +60
    Specific fuel consumption, kg/hp•h 0.290
    Dry weight, kg 295
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2017
  11. RMFAN

    RMFAN Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    http://www.eastpendulum.com/y-20-teste-transport-de-passagers
    [​IMG]

    The Chinese military transport aircraft Y-20 has just completed its first passenger transport test, according to an article on the Weixin account of the 603 Xi'an Institute .

    The design office specializing in the design of transport planes and bombers for the AVIC aircraft manufacturer gave almost no details on this test flight, but indicated that the test was the high priority of the Y-20 program. 2017, to verify the transport capacity, the design safety level and the stability of the systems.

    It is also the test that has embarked the largest number of people on board since the first inaugural flight of Y-20 which dates back to 26 January 2013.

    TANG Chang Hong (唐 长 红), chief program engineer, as well as passengers coming mainly from the different offices of the institute participating in the program, seem to be satisfied with the flight.

    Here are some testimonies gathered in the article:

    - QIANG Sui Hong, Office No. 1 (Structure)

    I am proud to be able to board a plane that I took part in its development. The number of colleagues who enrolled in this test flight also demonstrates our confidence in the Y-20. Through our own feelings and exchanges with the crew, we will have elements that will allow us to continue to improve the aircraft.

    - FU Qiang, Office No. 3

    The take-off distance is quite short and the landing is flexible, our system (on the sail) which allows to increase the lift has worked well.

    - MOU Wei Xing, Office No. 4

    This is the first time I fly on a plane we designed, I am very excited. These two hours of travel are extraordinary, the plane takes off and lands softly, we did not feel any trembling in the air. The interior (of the plane) is comfortable, one feels almost like in an airliner.

    - LUO Jing Feng, Office No. 7 (Fuel System)

    Proud to be on an airplane that we designed together, even though the road is still long in front of us.

    So how many people actually boarded this Y-20 flight?

    Although Xi'an has not revealed any details so far, we can still deduce a part ourselves. Given that the American C-17, which is larger and longer than the Y-20, is capable of transporting up to 102 fully equipped paratroopers, it is reasonable to assume that the nominal capacity of the Chinese exceed this limit.

    We also know the IL-76MD, of which about 20 are in active service in China, can carry about forty people in the bunker in standard configuration, and that this Russian aircraft is of comparable size to its Chinese counterpart, if not that it is much less wide (31.5 meters for IL-76® versus 4 meters for Y-20).

    The passenger capacity of Y-20 would therefore be between 40 and 100, in a mixed Cargo-Passenger configuration.

    And if we rely on two of the very rare photos taken inside the cargo bay of a Y-20 that has been equipped with the Chinese Air Force since July 2016, it will be noticed that the Chinese transport plane would have between 40 and 50 seats on both sides of the aircraft.

    [​IMG]
    Seats aboard Y-20 appear to be all numbered (Image: 四川 卫视; Comment: East Pendulum)

    [​IMG]
    The interior layout of a Y-20 in service in the Chinese Air Force (Picture: 四川 卫视; Comment: East Pendulum)

    Passenger capacity therefore depends on whether there are 20 or 25 seats per row, and whether the Y-20 who conducted the passenger test was in the same configuration of the interior arrangement with the one used as a reference.

    This suggests that less than 50 people from the 603 Xi'an Institute boarded the Y-20 for the first passenger test, which lasted around two hours.

    As for the number of Y-20 products so far, we had predicted last year " China buys 224 additional D-30KP-2 engines ", according to which two to three aircraft could be delivered by quarter to the Chinese military, starting in the second quarter of 2017, a pace 1 to see slightly lower.

    And the latest photos released show that at least five Y-20s have been admitted to active service by the Chinese Air Force, including two first copies introduced in July 2017.

    It is still too early to say whether our forecast model is to be revised or not, but at this rate the Chinese air force could receive up to ten Y-20 by the end of 2017, half of the IL- 76MD China whose supply channels are more or less discontinue.
     
  12. RMFAN

    RMFAN Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Chinese, Pakistan pilots in joint combat flight training
    Source:China Military Online Editor:Huang Panyue 2017-09-22

    Chinese and Pakistan fighter jets fly alongside each other for a combat sortie during the Shaheen-VI joint air training exercise in China's Xinjiang Uygur Autonomous Region. The air forces of China and Pakistan kicked off the Shaheen-VI on Sept. 5, 2017. China has dispatched J-11 fighters, JH-7 fighter-bombers, KJ-200 AWACS aircraft, while Pakistan has sent JF-17 Thunder fighter jets and early warning aircraft to participate in the exercise. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Qin Dijun)

    [​IMG]

    Fighter jets of China and Pakistan take off from a military airport during the Shaheen-VI joint air training exercise in China's Xinjiang Uygur Autonomous Region. The air forces of China and Pakistan kicked off the Shaheen-VI on Sept. 5, 2017. China has dispatched J-11 fighters, JH-7 fighter-bombers, KJ-200 AWACS aircraft, while Pakistan has sent JF-17 Thunder fighter jets and early warning aircraft to participate in the exercise. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Liu Chang)

    [​IMG]
     
  13. RMFAN

    RMFAN Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    http://www.sohu.com/a/147540587_670525
    http://mil.eastday.com/a/171004202241419.html
    https://kknews.cc/military/lxjvekg.html
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Air_Force
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth-generation_jet_fighter

    Chinese 4th generation jet fighters in service :

    J-10A : 280
    J-10B: 84

    J-11A: 105
    J-11B; 168

    J-16: 48
    J-15: 24

    JH7/A: 200


    Su-27: 48
    Su-30MKK: 76
    Su-35: 4

    Total numbers: 1037

    Chinese 5th generation jet fighters in service:

    J-20: 5-10

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Indian 4th generation jet fighters in service:


    HAL Tejas: 3

    Mirage 2000: 45

    MiG-29 : 66
    Su-30MKI: 230

    Total numbers: 344
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2017
  14. shaktimaan

    shaktimaan Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    :santa-mooning dude ur airfoce is mighty one, pls compare it with aliens force
     
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  15. Angel Eyes

    Angel Eyes 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Low quality chinese jets can't be compared to Indian fighters....
     

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