Dismiss Notice
Welcome to IDF- Indian Defence Forum , register for free to join this friendly community of defence enthusiastic from around the world. Make your opinion heard and appreciated.

Rafale deal signed

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by PARIKRAMA, Sep 23, 2016.

  1. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    Messages:
    5,174
    Likes Received:
    3,163
    Not really, since Trappier himself stated at Aero India, that Dassault has not decided about what to produce in India so far and that it might depend on follow orders. Diverting Falcon production parts to DRAL would be logical for Dassault and at least create some work in India, which is what the offset policy is about, but of course has no relation to Rafale or get India anything wrt improvement of defence industry. So far all offsets are mainly convinient choices for Dassault, Thales and Co, but have no importance for Rafale and most disappointingly, no relations to jointly improving Rafale. That's where Dassault messed up the most! Not understanding the value India could had for Rafale as a partner, rather than just another customer.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2017
    Agent_47, Ved Mishra and surya kiran like this.
  2. zebra7

    zebra7 Captain FULL MEMBER

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2016
    Messages:
    1,176
    Likes Received:
    1,199
    Country Flag:
    India
    LOL, lovers of Gripen -- Adani group which haven't have produced a nut for the Aviation is going to produce Gripen 60 planes per year.
     
  3. Paliwal Warrior

    Paliwal Warrior Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2013
    Messages:
    6,170
    Likes Received:
    901
    You are forgetting the main point

    Frontal RCS

    Avery typical condition very hard practically
     
  4. halloweene

    halloweene Major MILITARY STRATEGIST

    Joined:
    May 25, 2011
    Messages:
    4,334
    Likes Received:
    2,333
    More specifically, Falcon 2000 is well suited in terms of price, size and range for an emerging business jets market in India.
     
    BON PLAN likes this.
  5. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2012
    Messages:
    8,122
    Likes Received:
    5,928
    Country Flag:
    France
    Software-based virtual stealth technology reduce RCS in all directions contrary to structural RCS reduction which is mainly frontal.
    [​IMG]
     
  6. BON PLAN

    BON PLAN Major SENIOR MEMBER

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2015
    Messages:
    2,813
    Likes Received:
    1,410
    Country Flag:
    France
    All depend if india ordered 36 more (Made in France) or 90+ more (MII).
    As DA hasn't the answer yet, they seem to invest on something more durable. Why? Because the Rafale need, totally or partially fullfilled will not remain. But India's businessmen will need more and more Jet, and this is a win win business for far more time.

    And a same factory can built Rafale for 5,7,10 years and ramp up a Falcon production during.
     
    Scotlander and Picdelamirand-oil like this.
  7. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2013
    Messages:
    10,832
    Likes Received:
    5,822
    Yep. 220% and then another 80%. :lol:
     
    BON PLAN likes this.
  8. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2013
    Messages:
    10,832
    Likes Received:
    5,822
    Rafale and civilian tech are independent. Rafale offsets are completely different.
     
    BON PLAN likes this.
  9. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2012
    Messages:
    8,122
    Likes Received:
    5,928
    Country Flag:
    France
    It's a way to have skilled Man : conversion to Rafale work will be faster.
     
  10. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2013
    Messages:
    10,832
    Likes Received:
    5,822
    @halloweene @Picdelamirand-oil @CNL-PN-AA @BON PLAN

    Instead of waiting for the IN MRCBF program, what if Dassault bags an export contract, like the one with UAE for 60 jets, combine that with IAF's requirement for 36 more jets and initiate Make in India on their own?

    This way, GoI will be forced to order more jets off the line in the future. Potentially another tranche of 36 aircraft for IAF with options. Perhaps even a future order from IN for IAC-2 which could be for 100+ aircraft, particularly the Rafale-NG.

    This way the 60 for UAE and 36 for IAF will make the production line viable and will fulfill the Modi govt's desire to become a major exporter of high end defence technology, two birds with one stone. Rafale will then become a flagship MII program for India and will see more investment from the govt.
     
    Gessler likes this.
  11. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2013
    Messages:
    10,832
    Likes Received:
    5,822
    Most definitely. What do you think about my proposition above?
     
  12. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    Messages:
    5,174
    Likes Received:
    3,163
    Because they figure what is the financially most useful solution for them! If Rafale has a chance for more sales, diverting Rafale oriented production to India is more beneficiary, if not as it seems now, diverting production parts of an actually selling product to India with the scope of sales as halloween pointed out and possibly the benefit to reduce production costs, is the better choice.

    And no the requirement for Rafale is gone, if the SE MMRCA and naval MMRCA tender are finished. That's why there is no prospect beyond them. Either Dassault strikes the naval tender and an option order for IAF, or gets no Rafale production at DRAL at all.

    OEMs are only required to form a JV and divert production to India. It doesn't need to be related to the product we procured, it doesn't even need to be a production part at all, but could be maintenance as in the case of Thales. So if Dassault decides they want to use Falcon production parts at DRAL, via offsets, it still would be investment back to an Indian industry partner.
     
  13. randomradio

    randomradio Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2013
    Messages:
    10,832
    Likes Received:
    5,822
    Rafale deal has nothing to do with Falcon. If it was part of offsets, then they would have started from the day the contract was signed. This is completely separate from Rafale and they are yet to start the process for it.
     
  14. Sancho

    Sancho Lt. Colonel Technical Analyst

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    Messages:
    5,174
    Likes Received:
    3,163
    http://www.livemint.com/Politics/tM...mp&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=googleamp


    [​IMG]
    Source: Dassault Aviation
     
  15. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2012
    Messages:
    8,122
    Likes Received:
    5,928
    Country Flag:
    France
    Depend if UAE accept! They could ask for Make in UAE...
     

Share This Page