Dismiss Notice
Welcome to IDF- Indian Defence Forum , register for free to join this friendly community of defence enthusiastic from around the world. Make your opinion heard and appreciated.

Rafale's aerial war games with F22 in year 2009 ( from air & cosmos magazine)

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by DrSomnath999, May 20, 2012.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. DrSomnath999

    DrSomnath999 Major RESEARCHER

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Messages:
    2,664
    Likes Received:
    1,514
    Country Flag:
    France
    PLEASE NOTE : This article is from Air & Cosmos magazine which is a highly popular french magazine .Well as the pdf was in jpeg format i could nt translate it directly by copy pasting the article into google translate ,so i had to personally type all the french word in google translate & translate it ,so if by chance if there is any mistake in translation plz forgive me & also correct me.
    REGARDS



    Air & Cosmos magazine

    [​IMG]


    PG 1

    [​IMG]

    TRANSLATE


    Duels above the sand

    Saint Dizier November 8,
    A first wave of three Rafale of EC- 1/ 7th "provence" leaves the Haute-Marne for horizons much desertiques.Direction Arab Emirates (UAE) and; Air Base to Al Dhafia, no exercise for any fighter pilot in the world would miss the; advanced tactical leadership race, organized yearly by the UAE-ment. A total of six gust seventh join two waves of three aircraft based in Emirati 2009.ls this fall are accompanied by 15 pilots, of various backgrounds and experiences. All took the opportunity to come in trainer on a playground out of the ordinary: three times larger than the "range" of Red Flag, the Air Warfare Centre was created in 2000 in favor of the Gulf countries and their main allies that are s states U.S., Britain and France and other nations invitees punctually each year. The AWC has Emirati also the last word in matters of reproduction equipment allowing a very precise briefing at the end of each mission
    In 2009, the Rafale is participating for the first time at Advanced Tactical Leadership Course. But another poster invites outstanding shares: the F22 raptor American, including the U.S. Air Force has six planes Depeche piecing the 27 th Fighter Squadron, based in Langle y Air Force Base. Designed for the purpose of year quatr e-nineties, the American fighter is the fighter most modern in service today. It combines extraordinary aerodynamic performance has a very high stealth, but also has
    a


    PG2

    [​IMG]


    TRANSLATE
    weapons system built around a powerful Actively Electronically scanned radar and passive sensors whose operation is similar in principle to that of SPECTRA. Size of able to intercept at high altitude and in the dogfight: he has for that a thrust vector that guides the exhaust of its two engine in the vertical plane, providing extra maneuverability in all phases of flight.
    On paper, the F 22 Raptor and the Rafale have not much to see. While the aircraft was American (the most expensive fighter in the world) has been designed as a Plane ultimate air defense, the French jet aircraft remains a versatile and "affordable." The Both planes are not even competing on the international market: Washington and refuses to export its raptor, which is remain the "secret weapon" during a high intensity aerial conflict.
    The 2009 edition of advanced tactical leadership race will be all the same pretext in the first clash between the two planes

    A defeat for five draws

    The U.S. airforce has, however, poses stringent conditions surrounding this confrontation: the Raptor has not participated in any Beyond Visual Range exercise with any foreign planes. American Pilots accept only to compete in a dogfight 1 against 1 against teams that participate in the exercise.The pilots' s EC 1/7 seize their chance ... and the results are rather encouraging:
    On six times, only one would have resulted, after the pilots of French, has a clear victory over the F 22 Raptor. The other five would have ended on a "draw", that is to say a situation of equality that can be obtained by various parameters: duel drags on beyond

    PG 3

    [​IMG]


    TRANSLATE
    predefined time, depressing the "high-level" fixed for the year ...

    Two main parameters give the advantage to the Raptor in dogfight: its thrust vector and the immense power conferred by its two engines, which each deliver near twice the thrust of the M88! Although it is much heavier than the Rafale, the F-22 retains a formidable maneuverability that allows him to leave the most delicate situations BFM; same degrades if a lot of energy during impact operations at very high, it may be rapidly recovered by the engines. But the pilots are careful to qualify the Raptor invulnerable:
    "Faced with an F-22, Rafale can get in shooting position cannon but it must do so very quickly, lest the roles be reversed if the battle drags on," said one French aviator. In combat long-range


    PG 4

    [​IMG]

    TRANSLATE
    things are very different. The APG 77 radar performance and low radar signature of the aircraft, together with the ability to evolve in very high altitude (up to 65,000 ft) and Mach 1.7 without using the afterburner make the bird virtually untouchable ...

    Performance Spectra amaze

    The airmen of "Provence" leaving Al Dhafra December 12, after having accumulated 320 hours flying over 182 attractions. Many complex commitments have once again to demonstrate the versatility of the French fighter. an example: on a mission of bombarding Dement, the number two of a patrol of four Rafale dropped GPS-guided AASM six on six different objectives, while taking three Mica on hostile tracks ... all in just over a minute. The debriefing will show that the six objectives, apart near 50 km, were all destroyed, while two enemy aircraft were beaten by a missile hanging francais.Comme Red Flag, the French also praise the performance of Spectra in the location of ground-air threats: the Rafale made to advanced tactical leadership race would have been able to perfectly fulfill the mission of destroying defenses enemy air (SEAD) alongside the F-16 CJ U.S., which is the main mission. Now proven multirole capability that will allow the Rafale to finally make the difference against its competitors.





    SUMMARY

    Well it's amazing despite being a 4.5 gen fighter rafale did manage to get a win out of 6 engagements & 5 were drawn in the aerial exercise between rafale & F22 in (ATLC) in 2009.Yes the aerial wargame was fought in within visual range ,if that fight have been fought in beyond visual range the result couldnt have been the same .But 1 thing was indeed worth mentioning that rafale performed impressively well despite being fielded a generation ahead plane like that F 22 raptor.
     
    5 people like this.
  2. Gessler

    Gessler BANNED BANNED

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2012
    Messages:
    9,745
    Likes Received:
    9,636
    Country Flag:
    India
    LoNg TiMe No SeE Somnath bhai!

    Great find again! I thought the Jon Lake report was your best find but with
    this you've outdone yourself all over again! Your amazing!!

    Amazing to see Rafale outdid F22 1-0 in dogfights and ended 5 round in draw...truly
    amazing find! Keep it up! This forum needs people like you!

    Your hard work with all that finding and typing oughta pay off! May you
    get your hands on Sunny Leone or someone.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2012
    1 person likes this.
  3. DrSomnath999

    DrSomnath999 Major RESEARCHER

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Messages:
    2,664
    Likes Received:
    1,514
    Country Flag:
    France
    WELL i surprise people with sudden entry with such amazing threads which would make people go nuts :lol:

    What!!! SUNNY LEONE :woot:
    my pant is on fire .HAAAA.HAAAAA:sarcastic:
     
    1 person likes this.
  4. Gessler

    Gessler BANNED BANNED

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2012
    Messages:
    9,745
    Likes Received:
    9,636
    Country Flag:
    India
    In future I think you would also be the one to post a thread about Rafale killing J-20 10-0:smile:

    I know I can count on you.

    btw what about Lucy Pinder then?:lol:
     
  5. DrSomnath999

    DrSomnath999 Major RESEARCHER

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Messages:
    2,664
    Likes Received:
    1,514
    Country Flag:
    France
    yes provided there is any war in future .Ofcourse dont understimate rafale as it is a 4.5 gen fighter ,it FSO & spectra system are it's
    main assets .hopefully when we induct Meteor things would change dramatically
    Woohooo ,:pleasantry:
     
  6. Gessler

    Gessler BANNED BANNED

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2012
    Messages:
    9,745
    Likes Received:
    9,636
    Country Flag:
    India
    ^^Buddy i'm deeply interested about SPECTRA

    Is it superior to the F22's EW suite? If so then by acquiring this tech we can revolutionize
    our Air Force by applying similar technology onto Super Sukhoi, LCA MK-2/3, PAK-FA and
    AMCA, provided we get the source codes
     
  7. Manmohan Yadav

    Manmohan Yadav Brigadier STAR MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2011
    Messages:
    21,213
    Likes Received:
    5,716
    Country Flag:
    India
    A Thread as always ,
    thanks

    and guess what it was short enough to be read in one go
    and not in installments :partay:
     
  8. DrSomnath999

    DrSomnath999 Major RESEARCHER

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Messages:
    2,664
    Likes Received:
    1,514
    Country Flag:
    France
    well it is comparable to F 22 ALR 94 system .but inferior to F35's avionics & ECM suites
     
  9. DrSomnath999

    DrSomnath999 Major RESEARCHER

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Messages:
    2,664
    Likes Received:
    1,514
    Country Flag:
    France
    thank god, u atlast managed to read it at one go ,MANU .:D
     
  10. nicolas10

    nicolas10 Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Messages:
    466
    Likes Received:
    153
    It is the other way around. The F22 won 1 of the fights, while all the other fights ended in a draw.

    However, during this ATLC course, one Mirage 2000 flown by a french pilot managed to shoot down a F22.

    Nic
     
  11. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    15,359
    Likes Received:
    2,379
    Country Flag:
    United States
    Wonder why????? the Raptor has not participated in any Beyond Visual Range exercise with any foreign planes
     
  12. Picard

    Picard Lt. Colonel RESEARCHER

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2012
    Messages:
    5,865
    Likes Received:
    3,024
    BVR is nearly-useless anyway.
     
  13. Gessler

    Gessler BANNED BANNED

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2012
    Messages:
    9,745
    Likes Received:
    9,636
    Country Flag:
    India
    But the article says Rafale won 1-0

     
  14. brahmastr

    brahmastr 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2012
    Messages:
    162
    Likes Received:
    19
    have any source for your claim ?
     
  15. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    15,359
    Likes Received:
    2,379
    Country Flag:
    United States
    I think you all are dreaming, an enemy pliot will never see the F22 and never know theres one in the air till they hear their threat receiver a split second befor they are dead.


    DefenseNews.com

    The radar mounted on the F/A-22 Raptor and F-35 Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) can be used to fry electronic parts of ground-based radars and disable airborne cruise missiles, program officials for the planes acknowledge.

    U.S. Air Force officials and contractors have longed bragged about the active electronically scanned array (AESA) radar, citing its ability to track multiple targets, map terrain and protect planes from attack. And there have been hints of offensive capability, like a brief mention of “high power electronic attack” on one of the JSF’s glossy marketing brochures.

    But contractors say they have not publicly talked about the capability — until now.

    “It could cause actual physical damage to a system … providing it’s on the X-band,” a common frequency for military radars, said Wayne Wilson, the director of fighter business development for Northrop Grumman Electronic Systems.

    The radars — the AN/APG-77 for the Raptor and the more advanced AN/APG-81 intended for the JSF — emit electromagnetic emissions that could be used to damage or disrupt guidance components in cruise missiles, Wilson said. Other sources said the radar also can help deflect air-to-air missiles.

    It’s been a given that pilots could use the radar to track the missiles, or other aircraft, in order to attack them with their own air-to-air weapons. But, military analysts say, it’s the offensive possibilities that make the sensor-turned-weapon a much more powerful tool.

    They say the Air Force could fly a “wall” of Raptors or JSFs through an area to knock out enemy radars, sweeping a battle zone clean of many threats to aircraft and ground forces.

    The revelation comes as Air Force officials work to convince Pentagon officials to allow them to buy more of the stealthy, supersonic Raptors. Service officials want more than 400 of the jets, but Pentagon officials decided to cap the program at about 180.

    AESA Advance

    Mounted in an aircraft’s nose, the AESA radar is an active array of more than 1,000 modules, each with its own transmitter and receiver, phase shifter and amplifier. It’s almost like having a thousand small radars in one honeycombed dome.

    Onboard computers can delegate the modules to perform separate tasks, so that the radar can simultaneously track enemy aircraft, search for more, and check out the ground ahead. In the Raptor, the modules are arranged in three groups — one pointing forward, one to the left and one to the right — giving the pilot a wide field of vision.

    Northrop’s AESA radar was originally designed for the Raptor, then tweaked for the JSF. Now company engineers have created a new version of the Raptor’s AN/APG-77 by adapting design elements of the JSF’s AN/APG-81 and the AN/APG-80, which flies aboard Lockheed Martin F-16 Block 60 fighters. The new variant is intended to cost less to produce and maintain.

    “We’re taking the improvements we’re making on the Joint Strike Fighter and pushing them back on the Raptor,” Wilson said.

    Northrop Grumman produces the Raptor’s radar under contract to Boeing’s Integrated Defense Systems unit, which is integrating the avionics for the F/A-22 program, led by Lockheed Martin Aeronautics. Raytheon Systems of McKinney, Texas, is a joint-venture partner on the radar.

    The JSF radar passed a key milestone May 23 by detecting airborne targets at a Northrop Grumman laboratory. Two days later, Northrop Grumman delivered a new AESA radar version for the Raptor to give the plane better air-to-ground combat capability.

    The way the Raptor’s radar antenna is integrated physically and electromagnetically with the airframe helps provide a much larger transmission bandwidth for the radar, using less power, according to GlobalSecurity.org, a defense consultancy.

    The book “Advanced Tactical Fighter to F-22 Raptor: Origins of the 21st Century Air Dominance Fighter” called the radar improvements “dramatic,” especially in areas of performance, reliability and versatility. Written by a trio of authors including Albert Piccirillo, the Air Force’s advanced tactical fighter program manager from 1983 to 1987, the book said the active array capability would “undoubtedly lead to a variety of novel operations and quantum enhancements in electronic countermeasures.”

    There are other planes that use phased array radar — which use multiple electronically controlled beams and frequencies — but they have one transmitter and receiver for the whole radar.

    A different AESA radar will fly aboard the newest batches of the U.S. Navy’s F/A-18E/F Super Hornet fighters, which are being fitted with the AN/APG-79 developed by Raytheon Space and Airborne Systems, El Segundo, Calif. •
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page