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Shivalik Class Frigates (Project 17/17A)

Discussion in 'Indian Navy' started by Galaxy, Aug 19, 2011.

  1. Hidalgo

    Hidalgo 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Superb
     
  2. VJM

    VJM FULL MEMBER

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    Has the deal struck to construct 7 Project 17A-class frigate for the Indian Navy any info please share....
     
  3. Indian Jatt

    Indian Jatt Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    yes they have started construction of the frigates they will flush the decks for further decreased signature.....
     
  4. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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    INS Sahyadri sets out from Pearl Harbour to take part in the sea phase of RIMPAC-2014 -

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  5. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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    Some older pics of Shivalik-class FFGs during a visit to China -

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  6. R!CK

    R!CK 2nd Lieutant Technical Analyst

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    GE’s Marine Solutions announced that its LM2500 marine gas turbines will power the Indian Navy’s P17A stealth frigate. The LM2500 gas turbines will be provided by Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) Industrial and Marine Gas Turbine division, Bangalore, India under license from GE.

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    HAL will assemble and test the LM2500 gas turbines prior to installation; HAL is licensed by GE to do so for Indian Navy LM2500 propulsion applications. HAL also is licensed to provide service and comprehensive support including inspection, spare parts, maintenance and equipment overhauls for GE industrial and marine gas turbines.

    Separately, four GE LM2500 gas turbines will power the Indian Navy’s P-71 Indigenous Aircraft Carrier that, according to an Indian Navy press release, is expected to be delivered by the end of 2018. Vikrant will be the Indian Navy’s first indigenously built aircraft carrier; it was launched in August 2013.

    http://www.marinelink.com/news/turbines-stealth-frigate419181
     
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  7. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Indian Navy picks MAN engines for stealth frigates

    MAY 17, 2016 — India's Project 17A stealth frigates will be powered by MAN medium diesels.

    The Indian Navy has ordered seven of the 149 m guided missile frigates, each equipped with two MAN 12V28/33D STC engines. Construction of the first ship is expected to start by early 2017 with handover to the Indian Navy by 2023. Four of the ships will be built at Mazagon Dock Shipbuilders Ltd. in Mumbai, and three at Garden Reach Shipbuilders & Engineers, Kolkata.

    MAN Diesel & Turbo will deliver engines and auxiliaries, commissioning, documentation, training and spare parts.

    MAN says that the 28/33D STC delivers cutting-edge technology. Featuring robust and reliable engineering it has long overhaul intervals and a maintenance-friendly design that makes it possibile to carry out all maintenance work up to major overhaul without removing the engine from the vessel — extending the operational window of the vessel and reducing maintenance efforts to a minimum.

    The 28/33D STC also offers a competitive specific fuel oil consumption.

    "We are very proud of this major order for the Indian naval market," said Lex Nijsen – Head of Four-Stroke Marine – MAN Diesel & Turbo. "It also represents a breakthrough in India for the MAN 28/33D STC. The vessels will be built with new modular construction technique to reduce construction time. A significant share of the scope of supply will be sourced locally and the majority of the engines will be assembled and tested at MAN factory works in Aurangabad, India."

    The vessels will be equipped with state-of the-art technology in order to provide a major advantage to the Indian Navy in terms of anti-submarine warfare capabilities.

    The Indian Navy is one of MAN´s long-term customers and is operating a remarkable number of engines on different vessels like submarines, fleet tankers and also frigates in its fleet, which all are being serviced by MAN Primeserv.

    The project evolved from the "Make in India" initiative of the Indian Government. As MAN has already produced other engine types in its Aurangabad factory in India for over 25 years, it had the setup ready for localization of its most advanced naval engine. MAN says that by contributing to the plans of the Indian Government, it has once more shown its commitment to one of its most valued long-term customers.

    http://www.marinelog.com/index.php?...s-man-engines-for-stealth-frigates&Itemid=231

    Its confusing and we should wait for some official sources to confirm. LM2500 is the logical choice though.
     
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  8. GuardianRED

    GuardianRED Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Would help to explain to why LM2500 as the logical choice?

    +

    Wasn't there issues with GE when it came to commissioning of INS Kolkata?
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
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  9. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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    Both will be procured.

    We're talking about CODAG (Combined Diesel-and-Gas) or CODOG (Combined Diesel-or-Gas) propulsion here.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combined_diesel_and_gas
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combined_diesel_or_gas

    Shivalik had CODOG I believe (with LM2500 GTs and SEMT-Pielstick diesels). We could continue with that.

    Kolkata-class doesn't use any GE turbines, it only uses Ukrainian Zorya GTs and Bergen diesels.

    As of why it's a logical choice, well the Shivalik-class FFGs & the IAC-1 carrier already use the LM2500 variants and it's proven to be an excellent system. Commonality across the fleet is a nice thing to have, so yeah, more LM2500s.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
  10. Abingdonboy

    Abingdonboy Major Technical Analyst

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    Not only that but the LM2500 is already made in India (by HAL), simply the most logical option around.
     
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  11. GuardianRED

    GuardianRED Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Sorry My Bad... Not the INS Kolkata.... BUT

    The GE gas turbines are now in the midst of controversy, as reported earlier by Business Standard. The new US administration has ordered GE to --- pending a review of relations with US allies like India, the UK and Australia --- stop work on commissioning the turbines. The Ministry of Defence is searching for a way to bypass this ban, perhaps by using a non-US GE agent to commission the turbines. This unexpected delay could delay the Shivalik’s commissioning by up to three months. But MDL remains optimistic: a blackboard on the deck counts down the days for commissioning: it says 58 days.

    http://ajaishukla.blogspot.ae/2009/03/visit-to-ins-shivalik-indias-newest.html


    New Indian stealth warship halted by US bar on GE

    If the United States ranks near the bottom amongst India’s defence suppliers, Washington’s penchant for imposing sanctions and restrictions has much to do with it. Now, the US appears to have shot itself in the foot again. The Indian Navy chose to power its indigenously designed, cutting-edge stealth warship, the INS Shivalik, with gas turbines from American company General Electric (GE). But even as the Shivalik readies for sea trials, the US State Department has ordered GE to stop all work on the turbines it has supplied.

    Vice Admiral HS Malhi (Retired), chairman and managing director of Mazagon Dock Limited (MDL), which built the Shivalik, has confirmed to Business Standard that GE has received instructions to stop operationalising (making ready for operations) the two new LM 2500 gas turbines that it supplied for the Shivalik. GE has told MDL that there could be up to three months delay, while the new US administration reviews its military relations with several countries. India is not alone in facing this ban; GE has been told to stop work even with close US allies like the UK and Australia.



    MDL has clearly been taken by surprise. Says Admiral Malhi, “It is quite surprising that such a letter has been received from GE. They said the (US) State Department could take up to 3-4 months to re-look at relations with these countries. We don’t have that kind of time; we have to deliver the ship to the navy.”

    The Shivalik stealth frigate is powered by four engines, in what is termed a CODOG (COmbined Diesel Or Gas) arrangement. Normal operations are powered by two Pielstick diesel engines, supplied by France. The gas turbines kick in for short bursts during combat, when extra power is needed. They are less fuel-efficient than diesel engines, but provide high performance. This is the first time that US turbines have been installed in an Indian-built frigate.

    MDL is now exploring whether it can use another GE subsidiary to operationalise the Shivalik’s turbines, without invalidating GE’s warranty. According to Admiral Malhi, “If GE allows us to use one of its licensees, the delay can be cut down to a month. GE is not averse to that, as long as no American person is involved in the work.”

    GE has not responded to an email, asking for details of this delay. The US State Department has also ignored a request for information. A spokesperson of the US Embassy in New Delhi has sidestepped the question, replying by email that, “The State Department has not instructed GE in the conduct of this direct commercial sale. Aspects of this sale were subject to export licensing, which is conducted through the State Department.”

    When asked to comment specifically on blanket orders from the State Department to GE regarding commercial defence dealings with India, the US Embassy did not respond.

    Recent Indian frigates were powered by Russian turbines. But GE’s LM 2500 gas turbines were chosen for three Project 17 frigates (of which INS Shivalik is the first) because of their better reliability. More than one thousand LM 2500 turbines power more than 400 warships in 30 navies across the world. In addition, the LM 2500 is used for power generation in luxury cruise liners like the QE II.

    US defence industry sources indicate that GE is upset by the State Department’s directives, which clearly damage GE’s commercial interests. The ban, suggest sources, was imposed by an “over-enthusiastic State Department bureaucrat”, keen to display that the Obama administration was on the ball from the beginning. But in India, the ban is already generating talk of an unwise choice in going for a US engine.


    http://www.business-standard.com/ar...ip-halted-by-us-bar-on-ge-109030600007_1.html

    SO NOT Wanting to face this issue again .... MAN is a better choice??

     
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  12. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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    Well this was 7-8 years ago and we've commissioned all the Shivalik-class frigates since then without a hitch and even the IAC-1 has selected the LM2500 so I don't think IN distrusts the US supplier enough to not want more GE gas turbines.

    The MAN deal is for diesel engines. They are separate from the Gas Turbines, both have their own utility and one cannot replace the other.

    Shivalik had SEMT-Pielstick diesels and GE gas turbines. In P-17A, the GE turbines stay the same but we're gonna be using MAN diesels in place of the Pielstick ones.

    Please read post #4 again.
     
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  13. GuardianRED

    GuardianRED Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    D'uh!!!!!....... sorry Blonde mode on ..... Damn!
     
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  14. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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  15. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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    [​IMG]

    Klub missile launch
     
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