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Tejas far behind competitors, not enough to protect Indian skies: IAF

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by stephen cohen, Nov 10, 2017.

  1. stephen cohen

    stephen cohen Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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  2. Hellfire

    Hellfire Devil's Advocate Staff Member MODERATOR

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  3. Blackjay

    Blackjay Developers Guild Developers -IT and R&D

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    Tejas far behind competitors, not enough to protect Indian skies: IAF
    The IAF made a presentation to the government to explain why Tejas alone can't meet India's requirements.

    Sudhi Ranjan Sen | Posted by Sonalee Borgohain
    New Delhi, November 10, 2017 | UPDATED 06:55 IST


    [​IMG]
    The IAF made a presentation to the government to explain why Tejas lags behind Sweden-made JAS 39 and US F-16.


    HIGHLIGHTS
    • 1
      Tejas isn't enough to protect Indian skies, IAF told the government.

    • 2
      IAF said Tejas is far behind its competitors like JAS 39 Gripen and F-16.

    • 3
      The cost of maintaining the Tejas is much higher than other fighters.
    Tejas - the indigenously made Light-Combat single engine fighter - isn't enough to protect Indian skies, the India Air Force (IAF) has told the government. The response came after the South Block asked the IAF to scrap its plans of acquiring single-engine fighters from global, top sources told India Today.

    The IAF said the Tejas is far behind its competitors like the JAS 39 Gripen manufactured by the Swedish aerospace company Saab and the US made F-16 manufactured by Lockheed Martin, sources said.

    National Security Adviser Ajit Doval is understood to have raised the issue after the government asked the IAF to scrap its plans to acquire foreign made single engine fighters and go for the Indian made fighters only. Recently, the IAF made a presentation to the government to explain why Tejas alone can't meet India's requirements.

    Documents accessed by India Today reveal that the IAF has told the government that the "endurance" of Tejas in combat is just about 59 minutes as against 3 hours of Gripen and nearly 4 fours for the F-16. Also, Tejas can carry a pay-load of about three tons against nearly six tons and seven tons by the Gripen and F-16 respectively.

    "In other words, for target that needs about 36 bombs to be destroyed, one will have to deploy six Tejas as against just three Gripen or F-16," the IAF has told the government.

    The IAF has also said Tejas needs 20 hours of serving for every hour of flying as against six hours for Gripen and 3.5 hours for F-16.

    The cost of maintaining the Tejas is much higher than the other fighters. Also, both the F-16 and Gripen has a life-span of 40 years against just 20 of Tejas. And, in some areas the vintage Russian made Mig-21 is better than Tejas, the IAF is understood to have told the government.

    India is desperate for single-engine fighters to replace aging MiG-21s. The country needs at least 42 fighter squadrons to fight a two front war, but currently has only 33 squadrons. And, at least another 11 fighter squadrons of the IAF will have to be retired in the next two years.

    So far, the IAF has ordered 123 Tejas fighters but wants a better single-engine fighter to make up for the huge-shortfall in the fighter strength. Of the 123 Tejas fighters, only 40 will be Tejas Mark-1 and the rest 83 will be an upgraded version.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 10, 2017
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  4. stephen cohen

    stephen cohen Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    HIGHLIGHTS
    • 1
      Tejas isn't enough to protect Indian skies, IAF told the government.

    • 2
      IAF said Tejas is far behind its competitors like JAS 39 Gripen and F-16.

    • 3
      The cost of maintaining the Tejas is much higher than other fighters.
    Tejas - the indigenously made Light-Combat single engine fighter - isn't enough to protect Indian skies, the India Air Force (IAF) has told the government. The response came after the South Block asked the IAF to scrap its plans of acquiring single-engine fighters from global, top sources told India Today.

    The IAF said the Tejas is far behind its competitors like the JAS 39 Gripen manufactured by the Swedish aerospace company Saab and the US made F-16 manufactured by Lockheed Martin, sources said.

    National Security Adviser Ajit Doval is understood to have raised the issue after the government asked the IAF to scrap its plans to acquire foreign made single engine fighters and go for the Indian made fighters only. Recently, the IAF made a presentation to the government to explain why Tejas alone can't meet India's requirements.


    Documents accessed by India Today reveal that the IAF has told the government that the "endurance" of Tejas in combat is just about 59 minutes as against 3 hours of Gripen and nearly 4 fours for the F-16. Also, Tejas can carry a pay-load of about three tons against nearly six tons and seven tons by the Gripen and F-16 respectively.

    "In other words, for target that needs about 36 bombs to be destroyed, one will have to deploy six Tejas as against just three Gripen or F-16," the IAF has told the government.

    The IAF has also said Tejas needs 20 hours of serving for every hour of flying as against six hours for Gripen and 3.5 hours for F-16.

    The cost of maintaining the Tejas is much higher than the other fighters. Also, both the F-16 and Gripen has a life-span of 40 years against just 20 of Tejas. And, in some areas the vintage Russian made Mig-21 is better than Tejas, the IAF is understood to have told the government.

    India is desperate for single-engine fighters to replace aging MiG-21s. The country needs at least 42 fighter squadrons to fight a two front war, but currently has only 33 squadrons. And, at least another 11 fighter squadrons of the IAF will have to be retired in the next two years.

    So far, the IAF has ordered 123 Tejas fighters but wants a better single-engine fighter to make up for the huge-shortfall in the fighter strength. Of the 123 Tejas fighters, only 40 will be Tejas Mark-1 and the rest 83 will be an upgraded version.
     
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  5. Sathya

    Sathya Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    not sure if IAF is talking about MK1 or MK1A ..
     
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  6. vstol jockey

    vstol jockey Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    Off course they are talking about Mk1 only. But it is now very clear that IAF & IN are now acting as a cartel and this whole game of blaming LCA is to get more Rafales.
     
  7. sunstersun

    sunstersun Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    same frame + engine means the 1 hour endurance doesn't change for the better.

    big no go from the start.
     
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  8. Varun Chauhan

    Varun Chauhan IDF NewBie

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    Why do smell a bit of "Bash Indigenous and Praise Foreign" Masala produced generally by lobby of Foreign Companies.

    And if it is indeed true. I just have one thing to say to IAF.

    Why do you always B***h about Tejas? Just where is your SANITY.
     
  9. Sathya

    Sathya Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    MK1A might sport Kaveri Safran engine if its successful .. since no new orders have been placed with GE.
    Weight reduction is also ongoing .. significant of all work that been done is Maintenance side.

    i am surprised tejas only have 20 yrs life span
     
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  10. Sathya

    Sathya Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    i think here they doing it for F16/GRIPEN

    i was always of the opinion NSA & PMO are on the same page..

    i wonder what PMO might hold that even NSA wouldnt know.
     
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  11. vstol jockey

    vstol jockey Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    The aircraft is presently certified for 3000 hrs or 20 yrs. It can be increased.
     
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  12. shaktimaan

    shaktimaan Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    No, they are comparing Tejas with f16s and gripen as govt wants to cancel SE tender... I think iaf gone made.. They want 200 rafales and they also want SE jet other than Tejas... And i cant believe that gripen has 3 times more endurance than Tejas
     
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  13. Hellfire

    Hellfire Devil's Advocate Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Perhaps because the aircraft is still far from being able to shoulder the responsibility for the skies?
    Perhaps because the sanity exists and it is duty of the IAF to publicly tell the nation that they do not have the equipment to fight against two nations?
    Perhaps they (the IAF) is simply doing it's job, because if war was to take place tomorrow, an encore of Gen VP Malik will occur when the Chiefs will say that 'we will fight with whatever we have'?
    Perhaps because it is the responsibility of the armed forces to indeed safeguard the territorial and national integrity of this nation while the politicians undertake the class act of ruling in name of public and yet doing everything to undermine the very same territorial integrity and also fail to solve the security challenges either by diplomacy or war and at the same time take decades to undermine the defence preparedness in the name of indigenous product while undermining policy and sectoral reforms needed to jump start an indigenous base?

    Was that a rhetorical question?

    Let me tell you the interesting story of the indigenous effort of producing an Individual Protective Equipment (IPE) used for NBC warfare. Our esteemed member @NS52 , in 1990, got a local Pune based firm to fabricate the same from an IPE brought by him from US. Till then, India was importing equipment from Sweden. In 1989, there was a lobby that wanted to continue importing the same (MoD) and tried to scuttle this attempt. However, a demo by the member was undertaken in front of Gen SF Rodrigues, PVSM, VSM the then COAS. Thereupon, the equipment passed with flying colors. (tested using choking agents by the member on himself in the Indian made IPE).

    Subsequently, it was decided to sort out the member for trying to get it made in India. A poor ACR was endorsed. Oooppps, I digress. Anyways, a novel idea was hit upon.

    The production and fabrication was withdrawn from the private entity and given to DRDO.

    Fast forward to 2016. Uri attack took place. Indian Army was placed on alert and full preparedness for fighting in a dirty environment (CBRN environment) was being prepared for. India imported IPE from US.

    Now, what happened? Oh my God!! We indigenised the IPE :D Hence we didn't have them ;)

    Yippeeeee

    3 bloody cheers!
    Indian Army to be blamed for not being ready to fight in CBRN environment as majority of troops do not know the full form of CBRN let alone having seen an IPE

    @PARIKRAMA @nair @Levina @randomradio

    Want me to wash dirty linen in public?
     
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  14. vstol jockey

    vstol jockey Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    They are just fooling the govt. Gripen NG with D/ts will have that endurance and give two D/Ts to Tejas, it too will have same endurance.
     
  15. Sathya

    Sathya Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    i think they are comparing Tejas mk1 specs achieved so far with Gripen E specs
    drop tanks of gripen can carry more fuel.

    its just to get the opinion on their side.
     

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