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The Indian Navy's helicopter plans and purchases

Discussion in 'Indian Navy' started by Agent_47, Nov 30, 2016.

  1. Abingdonboy

    Abingdonboy Major Technical Analyst

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    I would agree.


    However, once again the same question will arise- why is the IN seemingly intentionally excluding the ALH? They have set the MTOW at 5 tons, barely 0.5-0.7tons shy of the ALH's MTOW, why haven't they been building their smaller ships (OPV and such) around the ALH instead of designing them to an as yet unknown foreign NUH in the 4-5t class?

    All of the issues identified by the IN in the past have been resolved and they themselves have ordered 16 ALH Mk.3 (supposedly with a maritime radar) just last year, why the heck are they insistent on a foreign NUH? @Sancho @Ankit Kumar 001 @Agent_47 @Gessler @PARIKRAMA



    With the kind of numbers involved (both <100) this is not needed, there will be significant enough scale for each deal to stand alone in its own right and there's no need to go for a single OEM for both catergories. I also seriously doubt this would be allowed under the SPM.

    NH-90 isn't a likely contender so irrelevent. And it would be absurd to generalise the way you have- American helos are not simply superior like for like.

    The Panther for example has massive international success and that includes inside India (Pawan Hans is one of the world's most experienced Dauphin operators), the USCG itself operates this LUH.
     
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  2. X_Killer

    X_Killer Captain FULL MEMBER

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    Let's talk about the Australian case , they bought a few Tigers but these tigers are not capable to fulfill their needs.
    Also NH90 is still yet to achieve its FOC which is planned for April'19

    Their Defense chief also recommended to opt for some 12 S-70 to fulfill the gap.
     
  3. X_Killer

    X_Killer Captain FULL MEMBER

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    I would also like to see it ...

    It's not a essential to go for a single vendor for both but it might get some priority if one of the helo is selected and other one stuck due to minor negotiation issue,
     
  4. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog Staff Member MODERATOR

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    That is a weird justification something never heard of. Both are entirely different aircraft with no commonality.

    IN has made this job easy by making it detailed and comprehensive. OEM now have clear timeline to fulfill it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2017
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  5. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Bottom line: European helicopters have a hard time achieving and sustaining readiness rates of 50-60 percent. Its quite likely that India will achieve and sustain far less when they add their dysfunctional problems to the Europeans.

    "the dysfunction in India’s civil-military relations reduces the impact of rearmament. Arming without aiming has some purpose in persuading other great powers of India’s benign rise, but it cannot be the basis of military planning." https://www.brookings.edu/research/the-drag-on-indias-military-growth/
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2017
  6. Abingdonboy

    Abingdonboy Major Technical Analyst

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    Read the tender document- Performance Based Logistics (PBL) are to be in place from the outset meaning the OEM will have to deliver a minimum availability rate (likely >75%) to the IN, India is signing PBLs for pretty much every major procurement now (MKIs, Rafale, C-17, C-130, P-8, even the ALH) so this is irrelevent.

    From what I understand, the French forces are seeing less than optimal availability rates because of the lack of PBLs and resources to spend on upkeep, not because the machines are capable of high availability rates am I right @BON PLAN @Vergennes @Picdelamirand-oil ?
     
  7. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Right, the seller is going to guarantee minimum availability even though India will be preforming the repairs, producing some of the parts and etc. Get real.
     
  8. Abingdonboy

    Abingdonboy Major Technical Analyst

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    I don't know what more to say, it is literally right there in black and white. It's the fourth line down in the introduction for god's sake! Do you not understand how PBLs work?

    US, Russian, Indian and French companies have all signed PBLs with Indian services (IAF and IN so far) with no problem, if you have inside information as to why this won't be possible for the NMRH/NUH then I am willing to hear it otherwise it is yet another unfounded and pointless comment.
     
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  9. Ankit Kumar 001

    Ankit Kumar 001 Major Technical Analyst

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    Panther is going to beat Bell and H225M is going to beat Sirkosky ....

    Now burn :chilli:
     
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  10. Indian Jatt

    Indian Jatt Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    The most important helicopters are the ones to replace sea Kings, and other helicopters used by our Frontline ships, we need S70s asap, our ASW helicopter fleet is almost a dud, dhruv is not potent enough for Asw warfare,rest all can come later, first bring 40 s70s
     
  11. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    Or 40 NH90 NFH Caïman.
     
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  12. Indian Jatt

    Indian Jatt Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Who ever wins...:rolleyes:
     
  13. Picdelamirand-oil

    Picdelamirand-oil Lt. Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    From Wikipedia NH 90
    Operators

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG] Australia
    [​IMG] Belgium
    [​IMG] Finland
    [​IMG] France
    [​IMG] Germany
    [​IMG] Greece
    [​IMG] Italy
    [​IMG] Netherlands
    [​IMG] New Zealand
    [​IMG] Norway
    [​IMG] Oman
    [​IMG] Spain
    [​IMG] Sweden
    [​IMG] Qatar
     
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  14. Notsuperstitious

    Notsuperstitious 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Why does everything have to be a science project?
     
  15. ashkum2278

    ashkum2278 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    RMAF H225M helo at #LIMA2015
     

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