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To fill urgent Indian Navy need, Centre eyes Canada’s used Sea King helicopters

Discussion in 'Indian Navy' started by Sancho, Apr 5, 2017.

  1. Sancho

    Sancho Major Technical Analyst

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    http://www.financialexpress.com/ind...yes-canadas-used-sea-king-helicopters/615283/
     
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  2. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Pathetic situation for navy helicopters . $1 billion dollar destroyers sailing without $20 million ASW helicopters.

    Took 4-5 years to choose S-70 but failed to finish the negotiations which is going on for last 2 years.
     
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  3. OverLoad

    OverLoad Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Why not India produce their home made helos why looking for ex-Canadian used.
     
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  4. Ankit Kumar 001

    Ankit Kumar 001 Major Technical Analyst

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    That's the best we can manage ? Shame on Prime Minister of India to be not able to find 1 person in whole 2.5 Years who could do even a bit to reduce the problems in our defence.
     
  5. Ankit Kumar 001

    Ankit Kumar 001 Major Technical Analyst

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    Further , keeping aside the frustration and looking at the situation proposed.

    I would also like to point out that we bought 6 second hand SH3 Sea Kings too, but without any spare support, only 1 was flying till last year.

    If we can only manage to sign spare supply agreement for 5 years , many of the problems with our present Sea King Fleet will be solved .

    Also adding Canadian Sea King is not good logistics wise, the Westland, the American and the Canadian versions, all three use different variations of engine and gear box. Which will only complicate supportingthem .
     
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  6. vstol jockey

    vstol jockey Colonel MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    I support this deal as this will help us meet most urgent requirements till our own medium capacity helo comes online. Even if we order new helos for IN today, their delivery will start after three years and will take another 3-4 yrs for full deliveries. Waiting for Indian product will also take similar time. HAL has made great strides in helicopter designs and they seem to have mastered the tech of creating all kinds of helos in short span of time. Let us go for Indian product only.
     
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  7. Himanshu Pandey

    Himanshu Pandey Don't get mad, get even. STAR MEMBER

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    To meet the urgent helicopter requirement of the Indian Navy, India is expected to discuss acquiring Sea King CH-124 helicopters during the coming visit of Canada’s defence minister Harjit Sajjan. Speaking to FE on condition of anonymity, sources said: “At this time Canada is in the process of decommissioning four of its Sea King CH-124 helicopters. These four have very little hours of flying logged in, and four that were decommissioned last December were recently upgraded.” The helicopters, though being decommissioned, are still in condition of being flown.

    “The Indian Navy has Sea King helicopters that have reached the end of their lives and are constantly being upgraded. The Indian side is likely to talk about these machines as these could bridge the gap and to support the depleting Indian Navy fleet as the acquisition process for new helicopters is not making any headway,” they added. Several procurement processes under various categories of helicopters, naval utility, multi-role helicopter (MRH), naval multi-role helicopter (NMRH), are all stuck due to re tendering or blacklisting of AgustaWestland.




    now please use google translator if you can't understand simple English.
     
  8. Sancho

    Sancho Major Technical Analyst

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    Actually you highlighted wrong part, since it's more important to know why we need a stop gap, when the government had 3 years time to "fast track procurements" and be "decisive? That's what they promised to be better compared to the former government, but still we see scrapping of several tenders, not enough new additions of aircrafts and as this report seems to suggest, the blacklisting of AW still seems to effect the procurement policy's (although I have some doubts about that).

    So the issue is not that we seem to go for 2nd hand aircrafts (similar was reported for IAF too), but that we still need to bridge the gap because no decisions about new procurements were taken.


    @all I read an article from 2015 yesterday, that stated that the new MoD has "cleared" procurements for X amount, but that most of these deals were never signed and are delayed.
    Maybe somebody who followed the news in the last few years could male an info thread about cleard and signed projects.
     
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  9. Himanshu Pandey

    Himanshu Pandey Don't get mad, get even. STAR MEMBER

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    we had dissected and already declared that those Mig-29 news is bogus and shit.. same is with this helicopter news... no one is going to buy 2nd hand... if there is so much urgency in the eyes of GOI they can buy through FMS.. because these 2nd hand ones too will take 3 years of negotiation then customisation regarding Indian needs which will take 1 -2 years and till then we will have procured a new one in much lesser time..

    these news are sensational but not worth their salt..
     
  10. Sancho

    Sancho Major Technical Analyst

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    Well to be honest at this point 2nd hand is still better than nothing right? I wouldn't mind them, but the bigger issue remains the procurement of new once which needs to be much much faster.
     
  11. Himanshu Pandey

    Himanshu Pandey Don't get mad, get even. STAR MEMBER

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    no 2nd hand is not better then nothing.. it is equal to nothing as we are not going to get them in next 5 years even if this news was true.. but as this is not true and India is not looking for 2nd hand replacements... they are not better by the right of non-existence.

    and then if we need to go for such a stop gap.. we can put Dhruva in there.. that too is better then nothing and comes cheaper and faster.. till we can buy those 100 NUMH.
     
  12. Agent_47

    Agent_47 Admin - Blog Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Actual signed contracts are very low (Import). This government is unable to close the loop.
     
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  13. Sancho

    Sancho Major Technical Analyst

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    I'm still catching up, but the more I read, the more I get the same feeling.
     
  14. lca-fan

    lca-fan Captain FULL MEMBER

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    To fill urgent Indian Navy need, Centre eyes Canada’s used Sea King helicopters
    The Indian Navy needs over 100 multi-role helicopters to be positioned on board its most important warships.
    By: Huma Siddiqui | Updated: April 5, 2017 3:00 AM
    [​IMG]The Indian Navy needs over 100 multi-role helicopters to be positioned on board its most important warships.

    To meet the urgent helicopter requirement of the Indian Navy, India is expected to discuss acquiring Sea King CH-124 helicopters during the coming visit of Canada’s defence minister Harjit Sajjan. Speaking to FE on condition of anonymity, sources said: “At this time Canada is in the process of decommissioning four of its Sea King CH-124 helicopters. These four have very little hours of flying logged in, and four that were decommissioned last December were recently upgraded.” The helicopters, though being decommissioned, are still in condition of being flown.

    “The Indian Navy has Sea King helicopters that have reached the end of their lives and are constantly being upgraded. The Indian side is likely to talk about these machines as these could bridge the gap and to support the depleting Indian Navy fleet as the acquisition process for new helicopters is not making any headway,” they added. Several procurement processes under various categories of helicopters, naval utility, multi-role helicopter (MRH), naval multi-role helicopter (NMRH), are all stuck due to re tendering or blacklisting of AgustaWestland.

    Price negotiations for 16 MRHs with Sikorsky S-70B multi-role helicopters were stuck initially due to difference in base pricing and later the company was taken over by Lockheed Martin, which has further complicated things. Officials said that this deal will also guide the process for procurement of the much larger deal 126 NMRHs. The tender for over 100 NUHs was reissued last year but the shadow of AgustaWestland threatens it. The depleting fleet of the Indian Navy search & rescue helicopters — AW Sea Kings and the Sikorsky UH-3H — are both lined up for the life extension. Every major warship is earmarked to carry at least two helicopters on board to be deployed in various roles. But the last multi-role helicopter to join the fleet was two decades ago.

    However, replacements for these are yet come. The Indian Navy needs over 100 MRHs to be positioned on board its most important warships; however it has just about two dozen operational helicopters. These helicopters play a critical role of hunting submarines, taking on threats like enemy ships and sending early warnings about incoming aircraft and missiles to the fleet.

    The current strength of the Indian Navy is 150 warships, including two aircraft carriers, and less than one-third of the required number of helicopters available, thus forcing the navy to “pick and choose” their deployment and tasking helicopters. A senior Indian Navy officer told FE, “Helicopters are crucial in supporting ships or responding to distress calls on the high seas. But currently the numbers are so less that several ships are sharing a helicopter. ”

    http://www.financialexpress.com/ind...yes-canadas-used-sea-king-helicopters/615283/

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  15. MilSpec

    MilSpec Mod Staff Member MODERATOR

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    Not a fan of used equipment. They usually come with their own share of issues, and with the horrible job that we do with maintenance, it's almost not worth undertaking this effort to save initial cost.
    In this specific case as we do have an infrastructure for sea kings (not sure how effective it is), if the navy procurement directorate feels it's feasible, won't be the worst idea.
     
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