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We will crush the Chinese if they invade us - Taiwan warns China with long range missiles

Discussion in 'China & Asia Pacific' started by lca-fan, Mar 20, 2017 at 12:33 PM.

  1. Ripcord322

    Ripcord322 Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Read my 'PS', I clearly said I exaggerated the first line..

    Anyway....What I meant in spirit was that
    According to the GTI report of 2016...

    42 of our people died...42....When will this stop....Tell me when have the Chinese faced such an attack from their separatist groups in recent times.....Violent Naxals are a big problem....When we start supporting Taiwan....Who knows....The Chinese might make them more lethal!!!!


    The Chinese violate our sovereignty everyday through CPEC...and other activities....If we can't do anything to protect our own sovereignty.....How can you except us to question other's....!?



    Seperarist activity is much more violent and uncontrolled here than in China....And due to their deep pockets....They can incite it even further. THAT IS WHAT I MEANT. First let's get rid of Violent Naxals and other groups...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 21, 2017 at 11:49 AM
  2. A_poster

    A_poster Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    It would stop when it would stop.

    The only reason why Naxals are able to kill these many is because government does not want to wipe them out using extraordinary force, doing which would cause casualties among tribals and alienate them. Our strategy has worked way better than Chinese Uighur strategy and Indian state is taking back jungles of Dandakaraneya mile by mile, and most of local tribals hate Maoists. It is an area which has gone (and is going) from Maoist territory to hardcore nationalist and has given numerous MP and MLAs and two chief ministers to BJP. Take some effort to keep yourself abreast with current affairs.


    The problem with you is that you have no idea about how society works, and so not have knowledge of history. China may have pacified its insurgents by force, but it is one recession away from a civil war and possible breakdown. India ,by using softer methods, have integrated tribals in mainstream.So while India may be suffering more casualties, the result it achieve are permanent, while those of China is temporary. China has pacified Tibetans by force, but only thing it has achieved is ensuring that Tibetans bide their time for overthrowing Han imperial yolk. If they had recognized religious and cultural authority of Dalai lama, rather than launching a cultural revolution there, Tibetans would have become loyal Chinese subjects.

    Only place where Chinese tactics would be beneficial for India is in Kashmir because there people are fundamentally disloyal to India because of their Islamic identity, and here China could not do anything more than what Pakistan is doing. There is a reason why it was USSR which disintegrated, not USA, even though USA had more social divisions than Soviets.
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2017 at 12:20 PM
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  3. cuibw99

    cuibw99 FULL MEMBER

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    I think the strategies China conducts for assisting Pakistan is for China's long term benefit against national security, economic, trading, global influence, geopolitics, etc. I don't think hating India or revenging India is one of the motivation, also not directly relating with either territory dispute or Dalai Lama kind of things. So I feel that China will continue to invest and assist Pakistan in a foreseeable future. I think Russia might have the similar motivation for helping India.

    Back to your statement for supporting Taiwan to be independent, what is the goal you want to achieve and what is the benefit you want to gain? Is reducing China's support to Pakistan the goal? If yes, then this doesn't look like a efficient way and the situation might be becoming more worse. Or is the goal forcing China to consume more energy and resource on Taiwan so that to slow down the economic grow? This also doesn't look like the efficient way since I don't think the military support to Taiwan can efficiently change anything of Taiwan situation right now. If your goal is just revenging for the support China gives to Pakistan, I think there are lots of ways better than this.
     
  4. Domain

    Domain Developers Guild Staff Member ADMINISTRATOR

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    I can see the valid points you are trying to make
    But engaging Pakistan over India is going to hurt China more in due course of time.

    Why do you think China managed to grow this century at an excellent pace ? The answer is they were not hostile nor engaged in long term war with any potential adversary. they had differences with many nations but maintained peace and non-involvement overall in major matters.
    Once you start taking sides in others problems , your build up an anti-force , China's rise has been peaceful but in recent years it has started to be more vocal and assertive over matters which directly don't involve them. ( Classic example shielding UN designated terrorists - What benefit did China get out of that ? Nil except for bad publicity )

    Lets be fair there is not going to be an open war anymore between nuclear armed neighbours , maximum would be skirmishes and localized conflicts. China and India knows that very well , in this respect , the huge armes build up that China is trying to base its power on will not be used but will only act as a deterrent. The co-vert co-operation between China and Pakistan is only making the WEST gain in this region.
    The day India and China join hands with co-operation the subcontinent will be the best place to live in but that cannot happen because the Chinese are hell bent on supporting a nation whole sole aim is to de-stabilize the region in one form or other.
     
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  5. Golden_Rule

    Golden_Rule 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Well said!!!
     
  6. OnePunchMan

    OnePunchMan FULL MEMBER

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    no we just want to do this for shits and giggles but it would be fun arming taiwan with nukes lol
     
  7. HariPrasad

    HariPrasad 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Ya , you may be right but we need to help them. We must pay you guys back. You made an irresponsible nation which threaten us of nuclear war every alternate day a nuclear power. Do not forget that we can play same cards. You are not facing US but India. You must have realized that what we can do in last two and half years.
     
  8. cuibw99

    cuibw99 FULL MEMBER

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    I think the relationship between two countries is hard to have every benefit consistent. There has to be many things conflicted together with many other things cooperated together. If I remember correctly, in the past 40 years, china has been always protesting loudly when US tried to arm Taiwan, but in the meantime China didn't stop any chance to cooperate with US on many other things if the cooperation can benefit China. For the reality China couldn't change at certain moment, China just tolerated and focused on development. Getting more stronger(both economic and military) is the only way for China to get the county re-united again.

    Getting more global influence, offering more help to neighbors, creating the opportunities to reduce the conflict and increase the mutual benefit is one of the good ways to gradually convert the un-fridendly neighbor to friendly neighbor. I think this is what China has been working on. Philippics might be one of the examples.

    For India and China, I actually think there are lots of areas can be cooperated. For example, China proposed to help India on infrastructure construction several years before, which I think the very good cooperation toward win-win result. India needs infrastructure and China has definite comparative advantage on infrastructure construction. It will be pretty cost effective to have China helping on this, and China also has too many construction productivity need to release.

    For your west neighbor, I think China needs it to be firstly existed and secondly stable enough. China definitely doesn't want Pakistan to be a trouble maker, which is not allied with China's long term strategies. Actually I don't have much more knowledge about the history between India and Pakistan. Two countries have some territory conflict sounds pretty normal to me, but I am surprised that many people in this forum have the strong willing to completely wipe out Pakistan.
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2017 at 4:28 PM
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  9. Ripcord322

    Ripcord322 Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    What does that even mean !?

    Bad Publicity !!!! How does that even matter !? We didn't achieve what we set out to, that's what matters, Pakistan is a valuable ally to China...If they had nothing to 'achieve' out of blocking the ban....They wouldn't have done it.


    Cool. I will take your word for it then. Let's wait for that 'recession' yeah....I mean all our diplomats , Planners are scrambling for nothing! Let's just wait for that 'recession' yeah!
     
  10. cuibw99

    cuibw99 FULL MEMBER

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    I don't think any weapon smuggled to Taiwan has the chance to change anything. Please feel free to try if your insist.

    I think the nuclear weapon policy of Pakistan is the passive reaction forcedly made under tremendous military pressure and nuclear terror enforced from India. As far as I know, it is not Pakistan built nuclear weapon and threaten India firstly, and I don't think Pakistan has motivation to develop nuclear weapon if India didn't do it.

    For whether or not China offered help to Pakistan on nuclear weapon development, I don't know, and I think it is impossible to find out the official confirmation. Assuming China really did, I think it should be based on the strategic balance purpose for preventing Pakistan to be wiped out by India. Looking from the economic corridor, you can easily see keeping Pakistan stable is very important to China.
     
  11. HariPrasad

    HariPrasad 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Your country is such that it does not understand the difference between India and Pakistan. Who are you to decide balance between India and rogue and terrorist state like Pakistan. You helped north Korea as well. All terrorist and rogue countries are your ally and you use them as proxies to disrupt world order. When we tested Agni V, your country said that they will give ICBM to Pakistan. What a joke!!!!!

    Let me tell you that you have played all your cards. It is our turn now. You had a design to bully whole world but the net result is that those countries who had no guts to look at you are now threatening you. You pissed in your pant when we decided to sell Brahmos and Akash to you Vietnam. First you threatened us and when we laughed at you, you went and requested Vietnam not to purchase weapons from India. Your sell of your shitty weapons to Pakistan is not going to change any balance but our sell of weapons to Vietnam will change the equations. It is evident from your rattled reaction. You had a plan of string of Pearls against India but now you have a problem in south China sea. That is exactly we wanted. Your downfall has begun. Nobody is scarred of you. When Trump will improve relation with Russia, you will become a pussy cat. With the help of rogue ally Pakistan and north Korea , you are not going to get anything. Try to maintain balance by helping a rogue Nation like Pakistan and face the consequences. Let us see who is able to maintain balance.
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2017 at 8:33 PM
  12. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    I don't think in the USA there is the same fear of Russia and China there has been in the past. At one time it was more a fear of a hostile political, economic and almost religious philosophy of communism. As an average American there is not the fear of some one imposing their beliefs on the USA any longer and if a poll was taken today there would a bigger fear from most of Islam beliefs some day effecting the USA. As far as many Americans are concerned my self included if Russia or China are interested in Pakistan or Afganstan the more power too them. They are nothing more the snake pits. Most Americans see China and Russians as competitors then enemies. Russia just cut its 50 billion military budget, while the USA just increased its 650 billion dollar budget by 10 percent or 65 billion.
     
  13. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Russia Cuts Military Budget By 25% To US$65 Billion
    Our Bureau
    12:06 PM, March 17, 2017
    2603 views
    [​IMG]
    Russia cuts military budget 25% from $65 billion to $48 billion
    - A +
    Russian Federal Treasury released figures have confirmed that the nation’s defense budget has been cut by 25.5% for 2017, falling from RUB3.8 trillion (USD65.4 billion) to RUB2.8 trillion.

    The reduction is drastic cut in military expenditure of the country since the early 1990s. The reduction move follows an extended period of increases to Russian defence spending with growth having achieved an average rate of 19.8% a year since 2011 in nominal terms.

    However, even after the budget having been cut, the 2017 budget will remain about 14.4% higher than the level of defence spending seen in 2014 in nominal terms.

    The Russian government initially outlined plans to reduce defence expenditure in the draft of the three year budget for 2017 to 2019 released in October 2016, IHS Janes' reported Thursday.

    The steep drop in spending will continue to obstruct Russia's much-hyped defense buildup, which in 2014 promised to replace 70 percent of the Russian military's arms with brand new items by 2020.

    The modernization effort was intended to procure 2,300 new tanks, 1,200 new helicopters and aircraft, 50 new surface ships and 28 new submarines.

    Russia's plans to field a new generation of nuclear platforms, from new rail-mounted ICBMs to a new strategic bomber will likely be slowed or placed on hold.

    Low oil prices have reduced Russia's economy apart from high costs associated with the War on Ukraine.

    Russia’s GDP was $2.053 trillion (in U.S. dollars) in 2014, according to the World Bank, dropping to $1.331 trillion in 2015 — a drop of about 35 percent.

    http://www.defenseworld.net/news/18...y_Budget_By_25__To_US_65_Billion#.WNGYaIWcGM8
     
  14. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Donald Trump budget to increase defence spending by $70 billion, White House says

    Updated 27 Feb 2017, 9:29pmMon 27 Feb 2017, 9:29pm

    ...


    Map: United States
    US President Donald Trump has said he is seeking a "historic increase" in military spending of more than 9 per cent to be funded by cuts elsewhere in government.

    Key points:
    • Donald Trump says the budget will be about public safety and national security
    • President's budget plan needs to be approved by Congress
    • US already spends about $759 billion annually on defence


    Mr Trump will seek to boost Pentagon spending by $US54 billion ($70 billion) in his first budget proposal and slash the same amount from non-defence spending, including a large reduction in foreign aid, a White House budget official said.

    The President does not have the final say on federal spending.

    His plan to ramp up military spending is part of a budget proposal to Congress, which, while it is controlled by his fellow Republicans, will not necessarily follow his plans.

    Mr Trump told state governors at the White House that his budget plan included a "historic increase in defence spending to rebuild the depleted military of the United States of America".

    "This is a landmark event and message to the world in these dangerous times, of American strength, security and resolve," he said.

    "We must ensure that our courageous servicemen and women have the tools they need to deter war and when called upon to fight in our name, only do one thing: win."


    Officials familiar with Mr Trump's proposal said the planned defence spending increase would be financed partly by cuts to the State Department, Environmental Protection Agency and other non-defence programs.

    "We're going to do more with less and make the government lean and accountable to the people," Mr Trump said.

    Such a hike would be unusual given that the United States is not engaged in a major war, although its special forces and Air Force are active against Islamic State militants in Iraq and Syria.

    An official familiar with the proposal said Mr Trump's request for the Pentagon included more money for shipbuilding, military aircraft and establishing "a more robust presence in key international waterways and chokepoints" such as the Strait of Hormuz and South China Sea.

    'Comparable to the largest peacetime build-ups'
    [​IMG] Photo: The US already spends about $760 billion annually on defence. (ABC News: Giulio Saggin, file photo)


    That could put the United States at odds with Iran and China.

    The US military is already the world's most powerful fighting force and the United States spends far more than any other country on defence.

    Defence spending in the most recent fiscal year was $US584 billion ($759 billion), according to the Congressional Budget Office, so Mr Trump's planned $US54 billion ($70 billion) increase would be a rise of 9.2 per cent.

    But White House budget director Mick Mulvaney said the plan would bring the Pentagon's budget to $US603 ($785 billion) in total, just 3 per cent more than the previous year's $US584 billion ($759 billion) total.

    The rise would be slightly higher than the country's current 2.5 per cent rate of inflation.

    "President Trump intends to submit a defence budget that is a mere 3 per cent above President (Barack) Obama's defence budget, which has left our military underfunded, undersized, and unready to confront threats to our national security," John McCain, the Republican chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee, said in a statement.

    In a speech to conservative activists on Friday, Mr Trump promised "one of the greatest military build-ups in American history".

    Mark Cancian, an adviser with the Centre for Strategic and International Studies think tank, said Mr Trump's plan was in line with the kind of military spending seen before the Iraq war.

    "This is certainly comparable to the largest peacetime build-ups, which would be 2003," Mr Cancian said.

    How US miltary spending compares to the world
    • The proposed boost of $US54 billion ($70 billion) is more than double Australia's annual defence budget of $32.4 billion
    • According to a report from the Institute of Stratefic Studies, the top 14 defence budgets under the US combined (including Australia) was $US664 billion compared to the total US budget of $US598 billion
    • The rest of the world spent a total of $US317 billion on defence
    • The top five countries under the US were China ($US146 billion), Saudi Arabia ($US82 billion), Russia ($US66 billion) and the UK ($US56 billion)



    A former Defence Department and Office of Management and Budget employee, Mr Cancian cautioned that the proposal was far from being a budget.

    "This is just giving everyone the top line," he said.

    Nancy Pelosi, the top Democrat in the House of Representatives, said Mr Trump's plan to slash funding for federal agencies to free up money for the Pentagon showed he was not putting American working families first.

    "A $US54 billion cut will do far-reaching and long-lasting damage to our ability to meet the needs of the American people and win the jobs of the future," Ms Pelosi said.

    "The President is surrendering America's leadership in innovation, education, science and clean energy."

    State Department likely to take major hit
    The White House is sending Mr Trump's proposal to federal departments this week as he gears up for budget negotiations with Congress that often take months to play out.

    A second official said the State Department's budget could be cut by as much as 30 per cent, which would force a major restructuring of the department and elimination of programs.

    The United States spends about $US50 billion ($65 billion) annually on the State Department and foreign assistance.

    More than 120 retired US generals and admirals urged Congress on Monday to fully fund US diplomacy and foreign aid, saying that "elevating and strengthening diplomacy and development alongside defence are critical to keeping America safe".

    Mr Trump also said he would talk about his plans for infrastructure spending in a speech to Congress on Tuesday.

    "We're going to start spending on infrastructure big," he said.

    Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin, speaking on Fox News on Sunday, said Mr Trump's budget would not seek cuts in federal social programs such as Social Security and Medicare.
     
  15. Averageamerican

    Averageamerican Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    Beijing (CNN)China on Saturday announced a 7% rise in annual military spending, the smallest increase in seven years.

    My concern is with the USA having a 760 billion defense budget is when you have a big hammer every thing starts looking like a nail. No one really realizes what 5000 fighters and bombers,, drones a missiles armed with smart bombs can do.
     

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