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Why ToT?

Discussion in 'Modern Warfare' started by Osiris, Jul 11, 2010.

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  1. Osiris

    Osiris Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    why India demanding (or requesting) ToT (Transfer of Technology) in defence deals?
     
  2. jagjitnatt

    jagjitnatt Major ELITE MEMBER

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    India is a big country with a huge defense force. The airforce requires almost 700-800 aircraft in its inventory, the navy requires 20 subs with 3 aircraft carriers, 10 destroyers, 20 frigates, and the army commands a million man army supplying each soldier with armor and guns.

    The industry is HUGE to say the least. In such a country, it is not feasible to import everything. It would cost us a LOT. And to save the same, we'll have to cut down on our requirements, and compromise with quality.

    A simpler solution is to go for ToT, under which instead of spending billions of dollars in R&D, we buy tech at a much cheaper price, along with the end product. For a short term view, we get the end product, for the long term, we get the tech to produce it in house.

    Now our indigenous efforts can be based on such tech bought from other countries. Instead of starting from scratch, we have a proven and successful platform. It increases the quality of the product and also increases the chances of it working out as expected.

    If LCA, Arjun, PSLV, Frigates, Subs, LCH etc are turning out to be worthy products, it is only because we bought the tech from some other country first. None of these designs, I mean NONE are completely Indian designs, but they were derived and designed on previous experience gained from ToT of former products.

    In India, where the market is so huge, going indigenous can cut down our budget by as much as 45-60% which is huge.

    In an even longer term, the same technology mastered will be used to manufacture products, that will compete on the international platform, earning us even more profit, thereby reducing costs so much that they won't be costs anymore, they would be investments, that would return profit, they would become a business.
     
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  3. prototype

    prototype Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    well i think TOT is a much better option than reverse engineering, at least u dont loose ur image in the international community
     
  4. Desi Jatt

    Desi Jatt Captain ELITE MEMBER

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    ^^^thats right..ToT proves beneficial in long term...it does not only ensure a quality,proven end product but also gives you the tech know how for further indigenous production.

    infact after ToT we can also add our own accesories,devices or changes according to our needs.
     
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  5. booo

    booo Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    IMO, ToT will reduce the amout that we will spend in future on maintenance.
     
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  6. Osiris

    Osiris Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    Thanks to all :thumb:
     
  7. gowthamraj

    gowthamraj Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Another great advantage in tot is that we can less problem in sanction as local companies produce all spare parts
     
  8. desiman

    desiman Lieutenant ELITE MEMBER

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    TOT is much more complex than most people think. Its not as easy as just giving you some papers and drawings, let me explain what TOT really is -

    Technology transfer is the process by which basic science research and fundamental discoveries are developed into practical and commercially relevant applications and products. Technology Transfer personnel evaluate and manage invention portfolios, oversee patent prosecution, negotiate licensing agreements and periodically review cooperative research agreements already in place. Part of the technology transfer process involves the prosecution of patents which is overseen by the national Patent and Trademark Office. Individuals with advanced degrees in the biomedical sciences are needed to review and process patents in the biotechnology field.


    TT Function: Coordinate

    Coordinating between technology users and developers, between researchers and manufactures is an important element of technology transfer. Access to relevant internal and external resources to individual projects and enterprises has to be enabled.

    TT Function: Nurture

    A main ingredient for moving technology from a research laboratory to a new business enterprise successfully is an environment that is supportive of entrepreneurship. This needs to be encouraged by providing guidance, counseling and resources.

    TT Function: Link

    Cataloging resources related to business enterprises and connecting would-be entrepreneurs/researchers and other technology developers to outside groups and organizations which can help in the process of starting new products, companies etc. Such linkages provide referrals for individual business counseling, sources of financing or the names of individuals who can help with a particular facet of business development.

    Technology Transfer Activities include:

    processing and evaluating invention disclosures; filing for patents; technology marketing; licensing; protecting intellectual property arising from research activity; and assisting in creating new businesses and promoting the success of existing firms. The result of these activities will be new products, more high-quality jobs, and an expanded economy.

    ASSESSING COMMERCIAL POTENTIAL


    Commercialization is one effective method of transferring technologies. Establishing a technology's prospects for commercial success depends largely on five factors:

    1. Technical Development: The time, materials, and personnel needed to reduce the technology to practice and protect rights to the resulting product.
    2. Regulatory Clearance: The testing needed to demonstrate the product's utility and safety, and to meet federal regulatory requirements and to minimize or manage associated risks.
    3. Manufacturing Requirements: The facilities, people, and equipment needed to make the product.
    4. Market Development: The plan for successful marketing of the product, created by assessing perceived need for the product, size of potential market, expected sales, advantages over competing products, and the cost of promoting the product.
    5. Financial Feasibility: The development costs,costs to produce, operating expenses in relation to sales potential, net profits, potential liabilities, and return on investment.

    Constitueients of Technology Transfer Processes


    * Technology Transfer
    * Technology Promotion
    * Technology Deployment
    * Technology Innovation
    * Technology Development
    * Technology Research
    * Technology Assessment
    * Technology Information and communication
    * Technology Investment
    * Technology Collaboration
    * Technology Commercialization

    Some issues/themes in Technology Transfer:

    Basic Understanding Of Technology Transfer
    # What is Technology Transfer?
    # Overview of Technology Transfer Legislation
    # The Who of technology Transfer
    # Technology Transfer Related Organizations

    Hows and Whys of Technology Transfer
    # Types of Technology Transfer
    # What Drives Technology Transfer?
    # Main Modes of Technology Transfer
    # Benefits and Risks of Technology Transfer

    Intellectual Property Issues
    # Forms of Intellectual Property
    # Overview of Patents and Copyrights
    # Trademarks and Trade Secrets
    # Owning and Protecting Intellectual Property

    Technology Transfer Mechanisms
    # Overview of TT Mechanisms
    # License Agreements
    # Government Funded Programs
    # Grants and Cooperative Agreement

    Please read the following for some more information on the TOT process and how a TOT contract looks like in its simplest form. This process is one of the most complex in the defense industry and cannot be explained full on a forum. There are specialist who study this process as a job and I have worked with a few and believe me its boring lol The cost of such a process is why the recent submarine deal was so expensive if anyone wants to know.

    http://www.uil-sipo.si/uploads/media/Pretnar.PDF

    http://www.wipo.int/sme/en/documents/pdf/technology_transfer.pdf
     
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  9. prototype

    prototype Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    ^^ i have no idea till now that it is so much complex
     
  10. desiman

    desiman Lieutenant ELITE MEMBER

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    ohh ya it is, When i did my intern at LM many years ago, I had seen a team of over 100 people who are just focused on working out TOT details. All day they would be in the rooms going over mountains of paper and data. Its not a easy job and extremely boring also. They had a high turnover rate in that department lol. Big deals like the MRCA are often delayed because of TOT issues. out of the total duration of a project, the TOT takes a good 50% of the time.
     
  11. kchrai123

    kchrai123 FULL MEMBER

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    I dont think any country is going to give us their latest cutting edge technologies so easily. Even our best ally Russia is not willing to do do . We are their biggest customer but is there real TOT ? metals for SU 30 engines are treated in Russia and we just assemble them at Koraput plant. TOT is not so easy to get as claimed by GOI .
     
  12. RoYaN

    RoYaN Lt. Colonel ELITE MEMBER

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    TOT in most cases is never complete it a Percentage of tech of which Russia will give us the most and America the least% the Europeans fit some were in between!!
     
  13. Mr.Ryu

    Mr.Ryu Captain SENIOR MEMBER

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    Good insight on ToT thanks guys, I was aware of its important but not this much proved read worthy.
     
  14. GUNS-N- ROSES

    GUNS-N- ROSES Major SENIOR MEMBER

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    I would like to contribute my two cents (or is it two paise, dollar is anyway losing steam) to this thread.

    For ease of understanding i will stick to aircraft deals.

    ToT can be at various levels as mentioned below:

    Repair ToT: the technology to repair aircraft parts in house either at HAL or at Air force bases. The OEM provides relevant work/servicing schedules to HAL/IAF to undertake repair.

    OverHaul ToT: Technology for overhauling the aircraft item after a specified flight time. it is generally more complex then repair ToT and requires in depth knowledge of sytem.

    Production ToT: technology to produce a items locally. the technology (invloving source codes) is passed to HAL so that item can be built in india. so the air force need not go to OEM again for spares it can give order to HAL for additional spares.

    the level of ToT differs from item to item depending upon cost and level of technology. for example, take the case of two air craft components, main landing gear and radar. OEM has given ToT for both these items. OEM has given production ToT in case of MLG and repair ToT in case of radar. OEM refused to give overhaul and production ToT. so it means both MLG and radar can be repaired in india.MLG can be produced in india. however, radar has to be sent to OEM for overhaul.

    so when a aircraft deal is signed the level of ToT for each component is fixed. level of ToT might vary from item to item depending upon money asked by OEM or level of technology which OEM is ready to share with buyer.

    i hope i have made issue a lil bit clearer. i have purposefully used simple terms for better understanding of all users.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2011
  15. Wolf 9

    Wolf 9 Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Sweet Deals, Stolen Jobs
    By Lora Lumpe

    Originally published in The Bulletin of the Atomic Scientists, September/October 1994


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Let's say you sell cars. It's a competitive market. You could try to attract customers by offering the lowest prices and highest quality in town-but that cuts your profit margin. Instead, you offer gimmicks to persuade your customers that they're getting a good deal, even if they're not: CD players, perhaps, or fancy upholstery. You might throw in things that have nothing to do with cars, like microwave ovens or discount airline tickets.

    Now imagine that you sell tanks and guns and airplanes and bombs instead of cars. How far would you be willing to go to sweeten your deals? Well, in 1987 (the last year for which data is publicly available) U.S. arms manufacturers included a total of $2.987 billion worth of giveaways-called "offsets" in arms business parlance-on $3.037 billion worth of weapons sales.

    Offsets may seem like an esoteric topic, but they offer a glimpse into the real world of billion-dollar corporate and government deal making on the international arms market. Moreover, the effects of these little-known side deals on domestic employment, international relations, and national security are profound.

    Arms sales offsets come in two basic varieties. "Direct" offsets transfer military technology, typically by granting a license to the recipient country to produce a U.S. weapon system or its components or subcomponents. "Indirect" offsets-called that because they aren't directly military-related-may involve counter-importing some random product into the arms-selling country, investing in the buying country, or transferring commercial technology.

    The direct offsets that clinched the $5.2 billion Korean Fighter Program (KFP) deal of 1991 are increasingly typical. South Korea bought 12 off-the-shelf F-16C/D fighters from General Dynamics (which was subsequently purchased by Lockheed) as well as 36 aircraft kits to be assembled in Korea. But South Korea wants to produce an indigenous fighter aircraft, and it held out for the right to manufacture an additional 72 F-16s under license (see "A License to Steal Jobs," page 32). Korean Air Lines and Daewoo Heavy Industries had already produced some F-16 parts, and Samsung Aerospace produced parts for the F/A-18 fighter. But that manufacturing capability was nothing "compared to the level of manufacture and production line management contemplated under the KFP," according to the General Amounting Of fire (GAO). On top of the transfer of manufacturing and assembly know-how, Korea received ~-30 percent of the contract value-more than $1.5 billion-in undisclosed indirect offsets.

    Indirect offsets may be what Rep. Ron Wyden, an Oregon Democrat, had in mind when he called some deals "just bizarre" during a 1985 Congressional hearing. In order to clinch a $1.8 billion sale of F/A-18 fighters to Spain in 1982, McDonnell Douglas Corporation offered $1.5 billion in offsets. The aerospace company agreed to market a wide range of Spanish products in the United States, including steel coils, chemicals, sunflower seed oil, sailboats, paper products, zinc, and marble. The corporation helped publish and distribute a picture book on Spanish lifestyles designed to promote U.S. tourism in Spain. And in perhaps one of the oddest offsets ever recorded, McDonnell Douglas helped establish a Domino's Pizza franchise in Barcelona.

    ***
    How about this ---Domino's Pizza shop as defence offset !
    http://http://www.fas.org/asmp/library/articles/sweetdeals.htm
     
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