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Will India develop its own light tank to counter China Xingingtan for High altitude warfare? Options

Discussion in 'Indian Army' started by LonewolfSandeep, Jul 10, 2017.

  1. ashkum2278

    ashkum2278 FULL MEMBER

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    Last edited: Aug 4, 2017
  2. kakathiya

    kakathiya FULL MEMBER

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    Correct sir, more than light tanks we need light artillary which can be transported by helicopters, the present order of M777 is very less for such a long border, we need stinger missiles, antitank shoulder fired rockets, these Chinese light tank crap will be sitting ducks in the Himalayas, we lack good anti material rifles, why dosent we use kalanthak made by OFB, will be useful on these light tanks.
     
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  3. kakathiya

    kakathiya FULL MEMBER

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    Which r the ones india using, is it the stripped down monkey model? Russians don't give their top tech, is it true that Indian T90 is only T90 in name but low powered.
     
  4. Gessler

    Gessler Mod MODERATOR

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    India is using both T-90S and T-90M variants. No one will give you their top tech - will you give your top tech to others?

    The power (I believe you're referring to power output) depends on the variant & the engine used. Indian T-90s are every bit a T-90 as other export models of that type (or the corresponding Russian Army equivalent variant). In fact the Indian T-90 is somewhat better than the original export T-90 because of use of the Kanchan armor (which also makes our models heavier than the baseline export variant).

    But of course the Russian T-90s has undergone several upgrades since then and now newer variants are out with more powerful engines and electronics, like T-90AM.
     
  5. GuardianRED

    GuardianRED Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Sorry Out of Topic....... Its your dp...... Damn Bronn!!! , wait which Episode u are in?
     
  6. Angel Eyes

    Angel Eyes FULL MEMBER

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    So we've integrated kanchan armor in T 90???
     
  7. Angel Eyes

    Angel Eyes FULL MEMBER

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    Kalyani systems have developed own Bharat Ultra light howitzer....We could order them in bulk....It's cost is 1/3 of M777...
     
  8. kakathiya

    kakathiya FULL MEMBER

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    So actually Indian T90M is different from Russian export varient, indian ones r retrofitted with desi ideas, if its a stripped down model then why is it that our armoured corps want these monkey models, its better to have our own arjun tanks then these, these tanks r underpowered & light tanks, future belongs to heavy high armoured , fast tanks.
     
  9. kakathiya

    kakathiya FULL MEMBER

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    Yes, I think its a copy of Denel South Africa model, but I doubt our army will select it, the bearings used in Danush guns r found to be faulty as they r Chinese made, the contracter has cheated the OFB that its made in Germany, hope our private industry maintains quality & quantity.
     
  10. LonewolfSandeep

    LonewolfSandeep Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Bro your post are based on half baked info.. and so are your accusations, where you link genuine truth based info which you may have read somewhere & then linked merged elsewhere.

    Example: Kalyani systems Bharat Ultra light howitzer is a copy of Denel & India t90 engine not same as Russia. Both had same engine, if Russia sets up new T-90AM with upgraded engine, noone stopping India to upgrade engine in their own T90. As and when Indian limited defence budget approves massive cost of all T90 engine upgrade based on upgrade priority list.
    Denel Howitzer
    [​IMG]
    Source: http://www.denellandsystems.co.za/products/artillery
    TRISHUL TATA Power SED's 155m
    [​IMG]
    Instead TRISHUL - TATA Power SED's 155m is developed in partnership with Denel.

    Kalyani systems Bharat Ultra light howitzer
    [​IMG]
    which is a result of Kalyani Group/ELBIT Systems partnership. Hence similar to Elbit systems

    So Kalyani systems Bharat Ultra light howitzer is not copy of Denel Howitzer either.
     
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  11. kakathiya

    kakathiya FULL MEMBER

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    It's a shame that we can't make a 1000hp engine, by the way T90 engine is just 800hp do we need to keep hopes on Russia that they do upgrade their tanks & then we spend our precious $ to buy those engines for upgradation, this is crap, T90S is night blind r v waiting for the Russians to come & sell their products for exorbitant prices, as for light artillery, I am sure our generals who like phoren maal like a missy who is in love with foreign made lipstic, it's time we make & use our own.
     
  12. ashkum2278

    ashkum2278 FULL MEMBER

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    Any update on the 1500 hp engine that DRDO was developing for the FMBT. Cant these be installed in our T-90s???
     
  13. LonewolfSandeep

    LonewolfSandeep Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    A) In Indian T90, we are not bound to only put russian engines, We can put local or engines procured from foreign like germany etc.
    Hence, we are not bound by any rate Russia quote.

    B) Russians also have 1200 hp engines too, even chinese use 1200hp engine, example Type96 deployed by Chinese in Russia ArmyGames 2017 currently, features a 1200hp engine.

    C) On Generals wanting foreign maal - you should know that earlier Arjun Mk1 had severe problems & limitations, yet 248 was ordered. While MK2 was a work in progress, but better than T90, 118 qty Mk2 was ordered & probably to upgrade old Mk1 to Mk2 lvl slowly too.
    Since there was a push by Govt in 2016 to make India capable of implementing Cold Start Doctrine at the earliest, if you go through articles at that time, to punish pak in full if it undertakes another misadventure like it did example Parliament Attack/Bombay attack/Kargil. For this Heavy Vehicles Factory had capacity & speed limitation, also since India operates a lot of T90 as licensed manufactured, meant India had to get upgrade license to produce advanced version sooner or later or get them upgraded, this paved way for India acquiring T90MS license from Russia in nov 2016. (other option from Israel & former soviet union block was tried too for upgrade, russian offer option was cheapest as package deal) Thereby Mk2 & T90MS together could fill the minimum armada requirement in the shorted period, with India acquiring capability to upgrade old T90 to T90MS lvl later too.
    Hence push was more Govt & National Security outlook rather than Generals. Decisions consideration were a whole lot more complicated & taken elsewhere. Did military give consent, sure, as plan was sound & short duration capacity upgrade was a must.
    Dont malign Generals name pls..

    Note:
    Arjun already uses German 1400hp engine, as its heaviest tank in world. but with weight of 68.6 t will need to seriously cut weight wherever possible more & put upgraded 1500hp engine later. Also less than 30% of indigenisation content was in Mk1, which reduced further in Mk2.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2017
  14. LonewolfSandeep

    LonewolfSandeep Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    If engine size is same, or smaller, it wont be a problem to install 1500hp engines on t-90s.

    Future MBT (FMBT) was originally a new tank design that was to be developed from scratch for induction in 2025 and beyond. The FMBT and the programme would have focused on weight reduction in the design and was to be a lighter tank of 50 tons. However, the idea was dropped as no major breakthrough technology was realised in tank design that needed a complete design from scratch. As such it was decided to take the Arjun Mk II and upgrade the tank with new upgrades (suggested to follow Israel's Merkava tanks upgrade mythology for Arjun). Future tanks are expected to be based on the Arjun and will incorporate new technologies just as most other tanks.

    But if Arjun cant cut few tonnes of extra weight from current 68.6t lvl, then maybe could be a case of going for a fresh Foreign/Indian collaboration for MBT platform, as additional improvements from Mk2 to Mk3 is expected to take its weight to beyond 75t lvl, which could mean tortoise in high speed future tank battles (which Tanks are progressing towards lighter body, with more light layered, yet better amour & multi layered, active protection system, with even powerful engines)

    Thats why in the few defence sectors for Foreign/Indian partnership model includes Tanks as well, as Govt realises, that scope of Arjun beyond Mk2 be limited at best. Thereby meaning India will be searching for new base platform, on which India can implement its researched inhouse upgrade.

    Arjun for India, is like F16 for USA, F16 time is over, but F16 helped USA progress towards F22, similarly with Arjun Mk2 experience, will help India gain greater heights on a new light base platform in future. And a new platform is what India seeks.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2017
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  15. ashkum2278

    ashkum2278 FULL MEMBER

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    Has the HVF started production of T-90MS ? Which engine will power it? How many T-90 tanks do we produce/induct annually on an average?

    Thanks in Advance.
     

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