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With Bhopal Encounter, All Suspects Of Pune Blast Case Now Dead

Discussion in 'International Relations' started by Levina, Nov 2, 2016.

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  1. nair

    nair Guest

    2 different things, not to be linked......

    There was another post in between which got deleted.....

    Now coming back to the topic, Did the informer also killed?? ( sorry for my ignorance i have been away from news for couple of days)
     
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  2. arbit

    arbit 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Thats right no one shouted surrender. I have read the transcript. They got what they asked for.
    Moreover, the policemen used their judgement on the ground, risking their lives. I fully support and stand by them. I will not do anything to sow the seeds of doubt in the policing institution's collective psyche that they might not even take any action next time lest an enquiry be set up to hound them for the sake of vote bank politics.
     
  3. scorpionx

    scorpionx REGISTERED

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    There will be investigation and all the factors that made the officer on field shoot the suspects will be thoroughly scrutinized.
    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    The above is the hill where they were surrounded. You can judge by yourself if they could have escaped from there or not.

    When a murder is committed, the mental condition of the murderer does not come into consideration unless it happened in self defence.

    Can you quote the manual here? Even if they have killed a cop, it does not necessarily entitles police to shoot them. There is a specific guide line, look for it. For god's sake this is not a wild west cowboy movie where you can just chase any rogue bandits in the canyon and shoot them up. We are talking from legal point of view, not emotional, aren't we?
     
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  4. Joe Shearer

    Joe Shearer VETERAN MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    Are you aware that the manual says that every bullet fired is enquired into? Are you aware that blanket firing, firing without orders IS NOT permitted, and that is why a magistrate has to accompany a police force that is armed, that they can open fire only on receiving instructions? Do you know what is the meaning of 'reading the Riot Act'? Since you are such a pious, patriotic citizen, do you know why the AFSPA was needed in the first place, or is it your opinion that it was the same as you have quoted here, an avenue to kill without accountability?

    I have always disliked statements made based on emotion and on complete blankness regarding the laws. Wearing my patriotism on my sleeve is easy; knowing what is involved in upholding the rule of law is less easy.
     
  5. Sathya

    Sathya Lieutenant FULL MEMBER

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    Any link to the full transcript?
     
  6. arbit

    arbit 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    I believe there is a standard procedure where an investigation and debriefing is done after each shootout/encounter. Thats perfectly legitimate and should be conducted within the guidelines.
    To demand an judicial enquiry while obliquely hinting that the policemen deliberately hunted them down is what I disagree with. The intent behind the statement that Police deliberately 'murdered' them is not different from suggesting 'Why the police killed all muslims?' OR 'why only muslims were killed.' OR 'Why only muslims escape from jails?'
    It demoralises the forces and weakens the institutions.

    I see the pictures, and i can not conclude anything from a 25 degrees field of view. Show me the full pictures of the hill or a contour map and we will discuss it. What was the no. of manpower required to effectively surround it and what was the composition of police team tasked with apprehending them. How effective they could have been.



    It did happen in self defence, unless you are suggesting that the convicts were unarmed. The police force is authorised to use arms and are given the discretionary powers for it.


    I will try to look around for the relevant excerpt.
    I understand your point of view of maintaining the institutions sanctity. I concur with you except i don't believe that the police team acted with malafide intent to just kill them at any and all costs.
    Its just what i think will happen in a practical scenario. A group of convicts, who have murdered a cop while planning their escape are not exactly cuddly teddybears.
    Quite possibly the man in charge of the operation before dispersing his team warned his mates that the bhagodas are dangerous, possibly armed and willing to kill, having already killed before.
    So in that scenario if your first intent is to invite them for talks and counsel them into surrender, you will probably either get killed yourself or get some one else killed.
    There is noting emotional about this. Its about saving your own life and your team against a group of 8 jihadis. And like i said earlier, an departmental enquiry is fine but to ask for a judicial enquiry and call those policemen "Murderers" is outright pathetic.
     
  7. nair

    nair Guest

    Ok i thought it was related to this case...
     
  8. Darth Marr

    Darth Marr Captain FULL MEMBER

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    Neither do i, surprised you did not ask for a source....
     
  9. Darth Marr

    Darth Marr Captain FULL MEMBER

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    He already calls this an extra Judicial killing without any iota of evidence or even before an investigation, i believe any investigation resulting in evidence to the contrary of his believes will be probably termed as "fake". I can't mentally fathom why 8 Simi terrorists who has been involved in bomb blasts, slit the throat of an police officer and escaped form jail should NOT be killed.
     
  10. arbit

    arbit 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Yes

    Yes

    Probably missed that part. No

    I am not contesting your knowledge on the subject matter, merely the opinion that comes with it. You have called the policemen 'Murderers". Pray tell me what proof do you have of their crime, that the rest of the population bar few, don't seem to get.
    Just to clarify a point here, if it is found that the policemen did what you are suggesting, i am in full favour of law taking its own course.

    AFSPA is different, its implemented in this country where the insurgency and shoot outs occurs way too often for comfort. In Assam and J&K there are serious security challenges, and to compare them with sporadic encounters is, beg your pardon, silly.
    AFSPA, its reasons and associated consequences is a lengthy subject, we can discuss it later.
     
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  11. Joe Shearer

    Joe Shearer VETERAN MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    A fallacy. A pitiable fallacy.

    What demoralises the forces is blatant misuse of the law. The forces know that it can boomerang, that the people egging them on are not necessarily going to face the music with them.

    What weakens an institution? A law-enforcer deliberately breaking the law.

    Get your thinking straight.

    You don't have to discuss it. Your opinion remains your opinion. Nothing is decided by it changing. Nor does my opinion matter. Keep the judicious weighing of evidence to yourself; if you cannot exert yourself to get it, don't bother. In this discussion, we can at best deal with principles. And that is what I am doing: I am demonstrating that the apparent narrative shows our police in profound violation of the principles of law and order.



    They are NOT. And read the accounts; if the convicts were armed, they ought to have had arms handed over to them. And if they had arms, why were they throwing rocks?

    They murdered. That makes them murderers. Any circumlocution is pathetic. Even outright pathetic, if that is a stronger category of pathetic. I wouldn't know.
     
  12. arbit

    arbit 2nd Lieutant FULL MEMBER

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    Beware lest you be called emotional. Our emotions should be reserved for someone close to us. If a policemen is dead in the line of duty, who are we to get emotional.
    On a different note the discussion here is about the law and order and upholding the same, never mind the terrorists we are dealing with have no rules to abide by.
     
  13. Joe Shearer

    Joe Shearer VETERAN MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    Read up first. And get your orientation under control. Here we are, with the convicts bare miles away from a state capital, and no magistrate is available? What you call silly others might call, my apologies and I hope I haven't hurt your sensitive feelings, murderous.
     
  14. Joe Shearer

    Joe Shearer VETERAN MILITARY STRATEGIST

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    Ah what brilliant use of sarcasm to disguise a slant totally devoid of facts, totally committed to showing solidarity with the worst excesses of the state. Admirable!
     
  15. Darth Marr

    Darth Marr Captain FULL MEMBER

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    You called the police men murderers and you complain @arbit's lack of facts. Thats like saying terrorists were murdered by NSG's in 26/11, your line of thought is disturbing..
     
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